21

Other than revive and warp, I’ve never bothered with them.

22

Yes sense some people don’t want to be in guilds they could use a grapple augment. Or and a hammer augment that puts the hammer up 1 level of damage

23

It could really open up stores as well.

“Copper hammer + damage augment”

“Iron hammer +speed augment”

“Titanium shovel with 1x3 AoE augment.”

2 Likes
24

They are already limited by the skills (damage and speed to name a few) those are things you get as you advance and earn the skill points. And forging is also locked behind skill points. So you are already making the lower level players less efficient. And it is a good idea for the tools they use to be another layer where they should also be less efficient? So you use inferior tools and do not have the skills to make mining go faster and we wonder why players get bored?

I will disagree with this, it might just be the state of the economy, but it is difficult for a lower level player to sell the resources they can get from level 1-3 planets. Sure the items you can find on the planets with dangerous atmosphere are more valuable, but their access is locked behind skill points so they cannot farm those. And with luck affecting drops they are less efficient until they put skill points in that category.

And you won’t for the reasons already stated, if you have not earned and then allocated your skills to the areas that improve your mining efficiency you will never be as efficient as a seasoned player who has enough skill points to unlock the proper skill or have alts or additional skill sets.

Because the developers have stated in the past the game should be able to be played either way. That is probably one of the reasons they allow for alts and the additional skill sets. If they wanted to force cooperation they would probably have discontinued these when the game was released.

I think we agree here. The game needs to appeal to a broad base of players if it is going to be financially successful. even if they stop development, the servers still have to be paid for or it is not an MMO anymore. I do not think 3x3 AOE hammers should not require effort. OK now where we probably disagree. If I was making the decisions, I would make gem tools as they were in EA where the diamond had a 1x3 AOE. If you want more durability use the forge. If you want 3x3 use the forge. But at least offer a reasonable option for the players that do not want to rely on or use forged tools for whatever reason.

1 Like
25

Then why not sell forged items right now?..

26

The point is to get something that doesn’t require the forge or the insane mats it requires.

1 Like
27

But if people buy the items you mentioned they can also buy forged items!
That is my point…

Why buy non forged gear with some augment if you can buy forged ones?

28

Isn’t a non forged titanium tool and an augment cheaper than a forged titanium tool? Most augments are 125c-175 and non forged are 5-800c. Forged is 2k plus? Not sure if true. Just kinda what I’ve seen in shops

29

You are looking at it from the buyer point of view, I’m looking at it from the seller.

  1. They would be cheaper than forged. (easier to sell and buy)

  2. Zero negative effects

  3. No RNG, making it easy for lower level characters to create and sell.

  4. No high tier mats

  5. Keep a cap on them so multi-boon and high end boon still require the forge.

I’d also limit permanent augments to non-gem.

1 Like
30

Let me give a specific example. Copper.

Would you ever forge a copper tool? Other than a flashlight, of course not. If you are at the point that you can forge anything useful you have access to titanium.

But early level, if you could drop an extra-damage or extra-speed augment on a copper shovel or hammer, that becomes useful.

Easier to make, easier to buy, easier to sell.

31

I would argue knowledge is a larger inhibitor than skills- if you know how to refine rocks with exp food you can level up extremely quickly and easily, and get all the skills you need. This is made even easier with anyone feeding you knowledge and/or resources.

Here’s my point: If the system was simpler/easier everyone could do it, they’d have no need of the player economy rendering it largely useless, other than to save time (which would then only be utilized by established players anyway). If the system were more difficult it’d be a turn-off to even more players. Therefor I think it is fine as it is, encouraging to a modest degree to participate in the economy and community for goods and services from early on.

Well, I don’t know about others but I pay 19c/ea for Spicy Beans and Inky Leaves. That means 526 of these and you can afford a 3x3 T6 hammer that you probably don’t even have the atmospheric protection to use anyway (as a new player). Easily attainted on T1-3 planets. Not even including other resources picked up along the way. I’ve had several customers tell me how successful they’ve been just gathering for my (and others’) shop(s).

Fair, it should be playable either way- agreed. However, it will always be easier for the group than the individual. 'Nough said.

Maybe part of the disagreement is I was not here for EA and don’t know what things were like then; however I appreciate how they are now regardless. Slightly differing stats that you can use to your advantage but not so much different that there’s a clear edge from one type over another.

1 Like
32

I have… Even when I already forged gem ones as well…

I prefer silver tho, but no one is intereted in buying those, oddly enuff, makes one think tho…

Would they? What would an unforged titanium tool go for you think? The augment makes it a little more expensive than just the tool of course.

Then why buy them if they are so easy to make as.a low level?

33

I forge wood and stone too. Max loot and 3x3 wood shovel is a great lawnmower for collecting seeds for and mixer ingredients.

34

This is where it fails. At least for me and most likely a few other people. I consider myself to be an hardcore gamer and the amount of hours I put into gaming is on the very high side.(at least 5+ hours each day)

I also like finding the most efficient ways of doing things. And I also like a difficult challenge. I also play many puzzle games that fulfill this quite well (SpaceChem, Opus Magnum, Shenzhen I/O, Exapunks, Etc.)

The problem is the RNG. I don’t mind failing at things. I don’t mind punishing games. As long as I can look back at the situation, Evaluate it, and make an determination of what went wrong, why it went wrong, and how it is I failed. RNG destroys this process. because the result is then “You failed because the game felt like making you fail.” you didn’t do anything wrong, there was nothing you could have done when the RNG really picks to go hard and ████ you over. its just “No, your not allowed to win today. No questions asked.” On the flip side of things even when RNG is good to me, it is not very rewarding, Winning because of RNG while yes, I got the result I wanted. My actions didn’t have as much to do with it as I would like. I don’t like waiting for a game to tell me if I won or not. I want my failures to be my fault. And I want my successes to be because I did it correctly.

So when a system is designed with RNG as its means to try to create a challenge (out side of very select cases [PvP Card games] this is noramlly a very big turn off for me). The devs claim this is to make it exciting, It isn’t (Thou I guess i could see why if you have an gambling addiction ) You say its to keep us engaged, It doesn’t do that either. It brings dread. because I go in to the situation knowing that what I do will only have an limited amount of impact. And if the game really feels like it, the RNG can 100% ruin a forge, even if you use all the correct stuff and there is nothing you can do about it if the RNG rolls really hard the wrong way.

The only redeeming factors is there are some legal ways to slightly reduce the RNG, and there is an underhanded way to reduce the RNG that still seems to be valid to do despite me posting about it in the past.

But over all. If this system was designed to appeal to a certain demographic, then it must be people who don’t mind pulling the lever and letting the game decide if they won or not. Or people who don’t mind having a modest amount of the situation out of their control. Maybe its easier for them if the result of failure or success is not 100% on their shoulders.

4 Likes
35

I think this idea that if forging had no RNG it would eliminate the demand of those items in the economy is pretty silly.

This isn’t exactly true. I would say an economy that doesn’t have a lot of items does more harm than no RNG forging than good; which is what we have right now.

So if we had just a lot more categories of items to craft that people wanted then people would be required to pick and choose what they want to sell in their shop. The idea of a mega shop is dumb and I think isn’t healthy for the game’s economy; which is more of a personal opinion than anything.

I am largely against the RNG of the Centraforge, but I do want to see it remain but merely something that adds to the tool that already has an effect. So if Gem or Special Tools came with effects already on them, like Gem Tools did before Centaforge in EA, then we’d have a much different game right now. Most likely a much more populated one and that creates a positive feedback loop.

But if the developers want to continue to add in game features and systems that are complicated just to have more complexity in the game, then it’s going to be a nightmare for them to balance. I think these types of game design choices aren’t going to attract more players when the competition of other games is around every corner.

I don’t think people that bought this game or that backed it in EA did so because of whatever complexity that they perceived the game to have. I do think people quit because of added complexity to the game; which again is just my personal opinion and not an attempt to make up facts. I will end with this though: making something complex isn’t always the best decision to do when designing a product and sometimes something that is more simple is the more elegant choice to make.

Anyways, just my two cents about it all. :man_shrugging:

4 Likes
36

Please dont take away end game content. We need more progression/things to aim for, not less.

Forging is in no way restricted for anyone, and its perfectly possible for anyone to work up to it… as you can see by all the people who have worked up to it.

2 Likes
37

If it’s too easy then everyone can do it. Including me. Technically I am able to do it but have no time between other activities so I forge rarely and not the top items. I buywhat I can’t make.

A certain level of difficulty is needed to create market for forged items.

1 Like
38

I can agree with this in the current state of the game. We have very few items in the game to sell to another player. It needs to be multiplied by a lot. Do that and it will be difficult for someone to want to sell a bunch of other stuff along with forged items. If you don’t have time to gather stuff for several dozen different items and then craft it all up to sell in a shop, then that probably is going to be a good thing.

If the devs want players to interact with other players by having them buy and sell things from one another, they really need to emphasis more on giving us a metric ton more items to sell. I am specifically talking about thousands of items. We don’t have that and nowhere near that. Having that many items would do the game a lot of good and it would negate a lot of the argument for getting rid of RNG from forging as there would be plenty of item markets to sell items from.

2 Likes
39

Yup - exactly this! Started playing with it but I don’t have much interest playing for tons of hours to learn the exact steps to ensure some level of success when I have so many other things in the game I need to do in the limited hours I have to play.

I don’t mind the centraforge but think it was one of the biggest mistakes to bring into the game versus just keeping the gather/mine model simple to get us the results people want. Instead mining was turned into a grind and forging was added to ease that grind. Fix the cause not solve the effect.

For those that enjoy shops maybe… but all of us don’t want to run around trying to spend our very limited resources making some other person richer who set price on some arbitrary number they feel is relevant.

2 Likes
40

“Very limited resources” in Boundless…lol

But slightly more seriously if someone truly wants to run a shop then it takes a lot more effort than you’re giving credit for. My buying prices are based on what people are willing to sell me materials for. I then determine a rough cost-to-produce the goods that I sell. A slight markup for my time and effort, and vuala. Nothing arbitrary about it.