Your original reply was good for what it’s worth 
You’re absurd and made a post to inflame an order largely annoyed playerbase. Nothing you are posting is conducive to any sort of problem solving conversation.
2 Likes
My complaint against forced to have alts is that. by the very logic of it, your doing twice the work.
As someone pointed out in another thread, you need 2 level 20 characters to unlock all the recipies and able to access all parts of the game.
So you have to level up a character once. then reset and level up a second character as well. And people, like me, really don’t want to do that. But we have to, since crafting is a skill you have to physically spec into, to make tools, weapons, and the machines to make those things. Especially at higher levels you need high level skills.
But as for my whole ‘Two characters and 1 human isn’t Solo’ is because I don’t look at the human, I look at the characters. You have one character doing something, then have a second character doing something else. That’s 2, not 1. ‘Solo’, means 1. Even if it’s 1 person controlling the characters, it’s still 2 different characters.
Imagine if playing Minecraft, you had to quit the game, and change characters, whenever you wanted to craft something. Or whenever you wanted to hunt the mobs, or whenever you wanted to mine ore, or whenever you wanted to tend to the farm. Having to exit out, switch characters, and run the character over to the activity. While also having to do missions from many different jobs to get exp and money to level up and support yourself.
Can it be done? Yes. Is it easier than just being 1 character? Yes. is it mandatory? Pretty much. And that’s what I hate. It’s a sandbox, but doesn’t play like a sandbox. All in the name of being an ‘MMO’, which it fails at when you compare it to any other mmo, even other Sandbox mmos.
You need 2 peeps at 20 to do what 1 can at 40? Why not play 1 char to 40? It takes longer yes, see every reply I’ve given so far.
Edit- imagine if you played minecraft and you wanted a block sloped at 45 degrees.
I think this should have been the basic argument you made, it reflects how you feel about the game, and why you feel it isn’t fun. This is what you should expand on when you critique the game I think.
This basic core argument gets lost because you keep making factually untrue statements that other people feel the need to correct so new players don’t see it and become confused about the game, like those people who say it’s P2W.
I’ve shown you this isn’t true in other threads, some of the most popular MMO’s, the original ones, did extremely well and heavily relied on grouping from the very outset of the game.
I’ve explained that the current system allows you to sell what you gather for coin, then buy your tools from other players.
This is a personal opinion that isn’t shared with the majority of people who define “solo” play, in the same way that some people might think any cash shop is P2W, then review bomb a game for it, can confuse the majority of buyers who see “P2W” and actually think of true P2W mechanics.
Collectively agreed upon definitions by majorities are important, and I understand your definition is different, but I can assure you it’s a minority opinion and stands only to mislead and detract from your arguments.
In summary, I’m thinkin’ you would like the game to ditch the skill tree, right? In EA I think there were people who were upset the game moved further and further from sandbox and more and more into this mix of MMO and sandbox. I doubt the devs would backtrack now, and I understand why they moved away from sandbox because very few sandbox games have ever sold well.
Edit
But like I keep sayin’, I agree with your general feelings about the game, overall I like the game a lot, but I dislike how much grind there is, and I too think the game would have been better as more of a sandbox without a skill tree, such that anyone who spends 100 hours hitting trees is a great tree harvester, an anyone who spends 200 hours hitting trees is even better! 
1 Like
Just to point out a comment by the developers in the 199 testing thread
So arguing the game is only an MMO and should follow traditional MMO “rules” is questionable.
1 Like
1 character alone, with 100 skill points, can’t unlock every skill. Heck, even a dedicated crafter, can’t unlock every crafting recipe by himself, because some skills require you to do. Do you Brew, or Forge? Do you unlock T3 of Tools, Weapons, or Tech? <— That one alone takes 3 characters to unlock T3 for each. If you spec into Brewing T5, you can’t hit T5 in Food cooking, and vice versa.
And that’s JUST crafting, not including the Envirement protections to get on the higher tier worlds. Which remember, worlds 4, 5, and 6 which need those protections? That are Mid Tier worlds, those aren’t End game worlds. And yet they already need protection skills to get on them to collect stuff and live there to advance. So End Game is going to be even worse, and need more skills.
You also need to choose either Health or Energy and Regen for both. A monster killing alt needing Health and a Builder and gatherer needing energy.
More and more the skill tree makes you split, needing multiple characters to do things. Either you and a friend, or you and an alt.
Not that they ditch the tree, instead I would say 3 changes.
First being no skill cap and at lvl 50 you still unlock skill points.
Second being no ‘Choose one or the other’ skills. No Health OR Energy boost. Because every class, even crafter and builders, need both. Especially on higher tier’d worlds. And if someone wants to be a crafter, let them be able to craft all the recipes, not having to pick which ones they want, and forced to make an alt to unlock the others.
Third being an actual secondary skill tree we can switch between. Cause from what I read, and people told me about the Skill Set, it’s a completely useless item and feature. Cause it doesn’t have a secondary number of skill points, it still uses your own.
So if you’re lvl 50, you got 100 skill points to spend. If you use 25 on your main still set, then 25 on your second skill set, you’re out of 50 skill points total. So have to choose, either 100 skill points all on one tree, or use X number on a second tree, which will have less skill points used, and won’t have any skills unlocked from the previous skill tree anyways.
Being able to have Skill points be per skill set, instead of total across all skill sets, would help alot for those people that don’t want to make alts. Cause then they can just switch skill sets, each with 100 points to spend at lvl 50, instead of forced to create a second character. Both items, I remind you, costing the same number of cubits.
–
Two final bits, just for you, Creative. First:
Indeed you did, and I pointed out how they didn’t last long, and quickly died. Where as other older mmos. Eve Online, WoW, DDO, and so on are more Solo Friendly, skill kicking around, and still making multiple millions, even tho they are just as old as those ‘Forced Co-op Games’ which aren’t around anymore.
Can you really call them successful and popular games, when they all dead after a few years, and the only playbase they have are old players dedicating to playing just those games and nothing else? Meanwhile others with Solo ability are still alive and thieving and updating?
Second:
While yes, my ‘Definition’ isn’t the same as other peoples for what ‘Solo’ means, it doesn’t negate the intent behind it. Not everyone likes making multiple characters. Most people don’t. After all, most of they time they are doing twice the work for the same outcome, and some people just don’t have the time. Everyone is different, and forcing alt making or group play onto those that don’t like making alts, nor like working with groups is very damaging. You can’t really deny that.
As someone who has 200+ hours and is at end-game, I can tell you Builders and Miners don’t need the health epic.
Correct, but if you’re level 51, you have 104 skill points to spend. If you’re level 60, you have 140 skill points to spend.
Yes, “success” in the financial world is not measured by your standards, but by “Did this make us money, yes or no?” And those old MMO’s absolutely made them money. So, they were successful.
True, not everyone likes makin’ multiple characters, but you have no factual evidence to support the second claim that “most” people don’t.
This is true, which is why they buffed skillsets, for those who don’t wanna switch Alts. It’s also the argument you should’ve originally made, instead of sayin’ ‘solo play doesn’t exist’, your argument is actually, ‘I don’t like having to make alternate characters, and I don’t want to level up to 50 to get skill sets’.
2 Likes
If you read the first post you’d see I was already flipping his words on him heh.
I don’t think economy in this game is a failure, in fact I think is one of the strongest points of the game. The problem is that a healthy economy takes time and we are not yet there. The are a lot of plots with shops stands, but I cannot call them ‘shops’.
I think a good shop is defined for what it buys and not for what it sells. If you know a shop that will buy some of the things you don’t need, and you know the request baskets are always refilled with coins, then you don’t need an npc.
I’m running a shop ‘The miners shop’, where I buy any kind of color and you will always found a good amount of coins on the request baskets, so if you are a builder you can go for rocks, keeps the ones you want and sell the others.
I saw the other days a post from a guy that is doing something similar with wood, I hope things go well for him so you can have another option to make some money.
The only thing that I think this game needs urgently is a way to sell beacons (I mean a group of plots), so you can make some money being a builder and nothing else. As the game is today, if you want to be only a builder and nothing else it becomes a hard task to get money.
Also, developers have the tools to know which shops are important to the economy so in the case of one of these players just quit the game, they can fix the problem (I hope they do it)
just my 5 coins
1 Like
There are 2 very specific problems with this tho, one of which irks me badly and might ■■■■ others off too and why we don’t ‘sell’ using Request baskets.
First being, not every item is being ‘Asked’ for. Say for example, you accidently created too many Workbenches? Or any other Machine?
How about Stone? Or Refine Stone? Or Wood and Refine Wood?
How about Copper and Iron Bars, and not the ores?
This is the first problem. People usually only want to ‘request buy’ the basics. Ores, not Bars. Trunks/Rocks, not stone/wood and Refined stone/wood. No one ever requests any machines, or food, and many other items.
You can’t go mining for 12 hours, turn all your rocks into stone to turn into Refine stone, and turn those into Decoration stone, and then just find a request basket for Refine Stone and Stone. They don’t exist. Just the less than 18 rocks can be sold, usually for 1c each, so 17c max. Not much money for 12 hours of work, huh?
Then there is the second problem. The one I really hate, and I bet a lot of others do to. It’s when you go into a shop and notice “Oh look, they buying copper Ore for 2c! I can make some mad money with all this extra Copper Ore!” But then look around the shop and see they are selling copper for for 5c.
… For those of you too slow to process the ‘Issue’ here, let me spell it out for you. The shop, is hoping you are stupid enough to sell them all your ore for 2c each, so they can turn around and sell that same ore to other people for 5c each and make 3c off your stupidity.
And this is something I’ve seen in nearly every shop I’ve ever been to.
Generally it’s a good way to see who is a trust worthy shop owner or not, by checking their request basket against their sold items.
If someone is buying fiberish leaves at 10c each, and buying iron ore at 5c each, then you check and see their iron tools are 300c each, you’re getting ripped off.
And seeing stuff like that turns me off selling my items to request baskets hardcore. I make some money, yes, but I effectively get preyed on and someone else making even more money off of me. That’s something I can’t stand.
That’s one of the downsides to the economy in this game that people subtly prey on. Because they can request items to craft something, then sell it for more than they are spending to buying the items to make it.
Request Baskets should be to get items you can’t make without having to go out and buy itself, or sometimes willing to spend a little more or little less for something to get it quicker or from a helpful soul. Not to be used to prey on the stupid to make money.
1 Like
Well, this is why I said that there are a lot of plots with shop stands but they are not shops for me. I saw a lot of this stupid RPG like rate where a request basket offers 1 and the shop stand ask 4 for the same item. I just run away from that shop.
For the request baskets with processed material, perhaps I cannot see it, but I cannot find a good reason to add a request baskets with refined stone or copper bars. If you want the experience from crafting is ok, but I don’t know why someone will try to add a bunch of request baskets with this materials. But as I said, perhaps I’m not seeing it.
I see your point on people being greedy but also copper for 2c being sold for 5c is the least of rip offs. People hardly sell their metals and ive sold 1000 iron at my shop, buy for 4c, ive made 6k coin and have to keep making it myself because nobody sells to me cuz they want what im selling for or more. Centless on grovidias te is the biggest offender of all shops for all items. They charge 650c for reactive lamella and its not even hard to get anymore. They sell their coils for 35-40k ea and and pretty sure they buy all items at 1-10c ea. And they get tons of footfall because they have big portals everywhere so they are not short on coin.
Keep in mind too not everyone has tax epic and tax goes on both buying and selling, so if im buying silver alloy at 95c ea im actually paying 104c. And then i sell at 130 which gives me 117c, mean id make 13c on each bar, but ive only ever bought 5 and my prices are based on most others to be higher than most. If i dont make some extra coin i cant stock my basket to keep buying, im not buying and selling for fun, im doing it so i can provide a service and be able to support my adventures too, like most people.
Yeah, that footfall machanic is really messing with new or lower tier people that have low number of plots and/or out in places where people don’t visit often.
Sure, they get some footfall and it helps once in a while. But then you get to the people owning most of the land in capital and portal hubs and they don’t even need to play the game cause they can just buy anything and everything they ever need. Just cause they got up a portal hub first, or bought enough plots in the beginning of the game to start laying down a city quick with some friends.
Edit:
It helps the poor get pennies, and gives millions to the rich. The poor stay poor, and the rich stay rich.
Yea not to mention the amount of new people is going to putter out and new planets will stop spawning, so the opportunity to be the top of the world will stop existing…oh wait
Yea. Centless is pretty crappy. Ultima Hub had to force them to close some of their portals because they had 3 of them into our hub. If it were up to me they would have none.
Actually through biggest problem I personally see is this. After looking through all the skills, feats, objectives, and all other accommodations in the game, I was left feeling very overwhelmed. In particular there is a feat that needs to be acchieved by resetting your skill points. Resetting 1000 points. This is just too much, as firstly not everyone reads these forums and will learn that skills keep coming after level 50, second 1000 skill points? Even if you saved all your cubits, and had your 3 free skill resets, that’s 5,600 cubits spent on just skill resets tokens. This alone makes me feel like this is a cash grab. Otherwise how else is a player supposed to get plots for building, get the face masks, and all other manner of things that requires cubits to purchase. Either a significant increase to cubits earned, or vast reduction to cost of cubit consumables, ie plots, color tints, and other useables, will make players, myself in this instance, feel like paying for cubits comes secondary, and not feel mandatory.
I have been playing MMO’s since Ultima Online and this is just blatantly false.
2 Likes
This is just for single points, not full skill resets. You earn a skill reset point per level even after level 50 - no cubits are needed at all to achieve this.
1 Like
Thank you, another old’ie mmo player.
1 Like