Thats nice info though for the # you can just make a space before it. Quitely starts preparing for actually updating the forum guide again
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In truth I made this thread to raise awareness of the current durability for the tools(I got salty over the work and time I spent making iron tools that lasted so short). I do regret making this thread for that reason.
It was pretty fun recording the durabilities for wood>iron though. I’ll keep on waiting to hear what the devs’ plans are for the tools.
I’ll be on neither team like @Heurazio too 
#TeamNeutral. I can’t judge something that isn’t implemented yet.
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I’m neither judging nor concluding as well. In fact, I think that the devs are capable of making decent gameplay around a mechanic that allows repairing but also around one that doesn’t. So I’m just rooting for them to try the mechanic that won’t allow us to repair weapons/tools as I think that it can yield some interesting and innovative possibilities.
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I hope what I said didn’t sound like I was pointing fingers, because I really can’t speculate how one of the two would affect the economy in this game where trade isn’t controlled by a “Grand Exchange” or “Auction house”. Especially when I’ve been so used to it.
But yea, I’m still going to wait and see how they’re going to balance durability before thinking that adding tool repairing or not is a good idea.
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That’s definitely a ‘Luke’ one! 
Hi everyone,
@KuroKuma @Vastar @Heurazio @Thorbjorn42gbf @Miige @Zerus @Talathel @UmbraVictus @Nyuudles @ishred11 @Saint_X @Smoothy @sikerow @TheBirne @Havok40k
Great topic and some really good suggestions here. Durability and breakable items was always going to cause a certain amount of conflict, because it completely goes against the norm. But this topic has certainly given us something to think about.
What is clear from this conversation is that the current durability values feel unfair to you. We’ll be monitoring this and look at where the system needs balancing or maybe make items a bit more durable. However, it is worth noting that not all elements are in place and this system will need further balancing once these features are added:
- Progression - Upgrades to make your character more efficient (item durability, crafting speed, mining speed, etc)
- Crafting Randomness - Crafted tools will have base stats which will be randomised in a limited range based on your crafting skill level.
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This took a big weight out of my chest 
Thank you Luke!
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Wow, that are good news. Thanks for the infos … Especially the additional features to come sound interesting. Hope they come soon 
Glad to hear that you plan on adding some randomness to the crafting 
Now I cant wait to see your way of implementing RNG into the game (hopefully its a bit more than a bare numbers game)
I’m especially eager to see if & how you’ll incorporate the elemental mods that have been mentioned into an RNG system…(Something like an elemental version of the random weapon talents in The Division pops into mind)
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Added copper tools
Thanks to today’s update I was able to grab a hold of silver and titanium tools .
Sadly Titanium has little to no difference for its crazy cost so I advise not to work towards that. Unless titanium tools are the only tools that could break a gem… if I could find one.
Ruby at the very least can be broken by gold tools.
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Have you made a ruby tool yet? Do you know how many hits it takes for it to break a block by any chance? 
(im desperate to know)
I haven’t mined any. Gemstone tool recipes aren’t in the game yet (or at least the machine to make them isn’t). I think it still only takes 3 hits to break.
My big issue with tools is that because you need more expensive hammers to mine higher end materials, I end up carrying an a variety of hammers everywhere. I’m not going to waste my gold hammer on regular rock.
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A part of it is about the right tool for the right job and less about mindlessly hitting things without the need to optimize. It can certainly be fiddly switching between tools, but that is also part of the fun if you want to be a good miner.
Smart stacking should make inventory space less of an issue, if that is part of the problem for you.
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Thanks for thoughts and ideas. It’s great to see proper debate about features – it’s very helpful.
All the balance in the game is what I would call spreadsheet balance – some thought has been put into it, but mainly outside of the game. A big part of this early access process is to test the balance and tweak, and we will be doing that. I can see the case for the higher rated tools having more durability and we’ll take a look at that for the next balance pass.
As some of you have pointed out the reason that everything degrades is to keep the economy flowing. To keep all aspects of the supply chain working, demand needs to be kept up. This is especially true of weapons and tools as I think crafting / selling those will be a draw for many people.
If we allow people to repair their own weapons then the larger market might be in raw materials, rather than in the weapons and tools themselves, which I think will be disappointing to all the budding weapon smiths out there, as well as making the shops less interesting. If we make it that you go to a weapon repairer and pay them to repair your weapons then that activity is pushed back into the economy, but there are practical problems. How do you give an item to another player, have them repair it, then get the item back, and pay them money all in a way that doesn’t rely on trust? It would be a complex transaction, with a new interface unlike the existing crafting, and all that adds up to work to implement, and I’m not seeing the payoff for that work. Wouldn’t it be better to sink that time and effort into the weapon crafting and stats systems to make them better?
To follow up on the conversation about randomness in the crafting, we have big plans for that, which we will present in due course. The plans are still loose at the moment, so we need to work out what we’re thinking and then we’ll share. Don’t worry you will have the opportunity to comment before anything is committed to.
At a high level we’re looking at an extra crafting system (based around a machine called the Forge), into which you put “vanilla” items such as the ones in the game at the moment, along with extra ingredients, and after a few steps you get an upgraded item. As I say we will discuss the details in the future, but the intention is to have RNG, character progression, and human strategy / skill all play a part in the outcome.
So you will likely craft many items, and out of that will come a range of qualities, with a few duds, a large amount of good ones, and a few great ones. Crafting or buying a really amazing item will feel like an event and it would be frustrating to lose that item in a short time. Getting the durability of all items right is important, but particularly the more powerful ones, and it’s something we’ll keep an eye on.
So overall adding a repair feature looks like extra work and complexity for little gain. We will need to make sure that weapons and tools breaking makes a cool economy and is an exciting aspect of the game, rather than a chore.
I don’t want to shut down debate, and nothing is set in stone, so if there are compelling reasons for repairing in the future please let us know and we can rethink, but right now I’m not seeing the benefit.
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It’s good to hear that from time to time^[1]
How do you give an item to another player, have them repair it, then get the item back, and pay them money all in a way that doesn’t rely on trust? It would be a complex transaction, with a new interface unlike the existing crafting, and all that adds up to work to implement, and I’m not seeing the payoff for that work. Wouldn’t it be better to sink that time and effort into the weapon crafting and stats systems to make them better?
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That’s a good point which I was also thinking about. Maybe as a after 1.0 Feature?
And if you nail the durability of all the interesting tools and weapons I think almost nobody is against waiting a bit for a repair feature which might or might not come^^
quote=“olliepurkiss, post:50, topic:5042” ↩︎
Since the repair interaction is a problem, how about making a craftable repair item which can be sold?
Additionally, you could add number of repairs to all items as a stat. Duds cant be repaired, a good item could be repaired once or twice and an amazing item 3-5 times.
You could also have a range of durability repair from the repair items. Repair Kits, I suppose. They would have a random percentage or durability repair.
If the repair kit is expensive to craft, then only items that people are attached to will get repaired. But not infinitely. If only crafters could craft the best repair items, then the economy will be stimulated by that. People will buy the items and the supporting repair items together, I’d imagine.
That way there’s no need to create a new interaction between players and I think it would be simpler to implement. People want to take care of their nice things.
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As implementing infinite repairing would most certainly require a complete rework of the crafting balance I’d say that we just witnessed a sugar coated but definite “no” from olliepurkiss.
That’s a really cool “idea” (I assume you’ve played Dying Light? 
)