topkek
i hardly ever see 1 guy per hour at my shop
unless when i go to sleep some kind of hungry stampede visit my shop
that’s unlikely since it doesn’t reflect on sales
i’m sure that ff calculation is wrong somewhere
yes that pic represents total ff since i build it here.
i do not expect to be a succesful shop
i’m just a humble gatherer who sells his stuff at the end of the day.
This is also in response to Simoyd since you made similar points.
If you live in a city, and there are portal hubs, your benefit is being in a place where a lot of people go so you get more eyes on your wares. I don’t have any problem with that, that’s how an economy works. Footfall makes it so you HAVE to do that. Which, if this game were marketed as “A Voxel MMORPG with building elements” would be cool. All these systems are well known to WoW players (or w/e MMO you want to link back to). But everything I saw/the game tells you is that this is a sandbox game with other players. Sandbox games are going to have people that want to be off on their own. Those people should get to play the game, too. With footfall working as it is, those people can’t get money unless they do very specific things that are locked behind a long grind. Many find that unfun, I personally just think it’s a flawed system that could be better, and I love this game so far and want it to be better.
If footfall were to be removed, any system that replaces (and it would have to be replaced, outright removal would be a disaster) it would NEED fulfill a certain set of requirements.
Well if there is something broken in the code that is giving you free coin, that should be fixed. Because as presented, the math does not add up. Broken math does not equate a broken system though.
The confusion is that ‘sandbox game’ and ‘sandbox mmo’ have very widely differing meanings, and people that are more familiar with Minecraft than Ultima Online / EVE / etc, will probably think ‘minecraft with mmo elements’ rather than a separate genre entirely.
I’ve had to make this point several times on the forums because of this confusion (perhaps even on this very topic, it’s hard to keep track):
As has been stated quite a few times, you don’t need to be anywhere near a city to reap the benefits of good location, you just need a portal. It can be even a portal that is hidden behind a door in an outhouse if you feel that would improve the rustic theme of your remote location 
There’s no real pressure to necessarily be a part of cities if you don’t want to because Oortians have mastered the art of instantaneous travel.
While I agree with you, no one would compare this game to Ark or Eve unless they were talking about specific systems. When you make a game that looks like this and plays like this, people are going to say “Hey, what’s that minecraft game” and people are going to buy it expecting a minecraft-ish experience. That’s why I bought it. I’ve never played a second of Minecraft in my life because I do poorly with open ended games. I thought “Hey, minecraft with some RPG elements could give me some structure,” and it turns out that it did. I just find myself being hampered now by all these RPG systems that feel just slighly wrong given the frame I came into the game with, and I’m sure a lot of other people are having similar issues.
this is not pointed at any individual but rather at the Idea that being late to the game somehow puts you at a disadvantage. all of my exsamples come from pree 1.0. I feel that this is fine as the only real diforance between then and now is simply that we are all now playing in a bigger sandbox which is acualy good for the newer player.
so let’s began. I was the first person to conect the original 12 planets together in one portal network. this was before footfall so for a long time I was the only network out there. it was all for fun and to help the community get around.
finally footfall came out and over night there were tons of new lines poping in and out of the game. several months after footfall there wer probably four sucsesfal networks. mine and the fire caves being the top for quite awhile. then came the new guys. Ultima and the portal seekers.
I remember feeling bad for these guys 
we had such a foot hold on the network market that I figured they would be just white noise. realize that I had been on top for almost a year.
with in three month the portal seekers had become my equals and three months after that I was eating there dust. but me being a positive person the taste of dust was sweet becous not only was I still receiving a healthy chunk of footfall. I got to see footfall it’s self become the number one aspect of the game that fuled growth and exspantion.
to this day the portal seekers are at the top of the portal network game but this in no way means that will always be the case. people will enevadably come along and ither release them of that title or at least give them a good run for there money.
I say put on your big boy/girl pants and take your place as a contender. the power older players have is word of mouth but they have a weakness to and that is the fact that they are established. as a new player you have the flexibility to come up with that new idea that people will love, follow, and emulate.
@the-moebius and aquatopia is also one of my favoret success stories of pree 1.0. as a total noob he says to everyone. "hay lets start a new community based city where new and old players alike can prosper.
in no time and I really mean in no time at all his was the biggest city in the game. I don’t even think he had hit level 30 at that point.
so in short being new is only as much of a disadvantage as you make it. the people that are the most successful are the people that decide before starting that they will be the most successful.
unlike a lot of people who can keep an argument going for hundreds of postes I am not a master-debater. so this will most likely be my only comment here.
remember to keep it civil peace out 
Maybe portal network keepers should do cooperative world event where all portals are closed down. Maybe then for a while we didn’t get those gem mining is slow threads pop up 
I think footfall is not anyway huge income source, if some player is in need of coins they can always create temp toon and complete tutorial and some easy feats. Just check some feats rewards and generate needed coins this way and you don’t need to ever care about footfall coin system again.
Yep, but that doesn’t mean, as some (not you as far as I can tell, but some) would imply, that the description is a false pretense to lure people in. The game is described appropriately for the genre, it’s just a side effect of the voxel looks that people fixate on the ‘sandbox’ bit and then gloss over the fact that the actual full term is ‘sandbox mmo’, which does (as pointed in the link) mean something entirely separate and that has existed since before Mineraft was even a concept.
Perhaps extra, super clear advertisement would help mitigate this confusion, but I’d imagine it’s very hard to dismiss preconceptions that exist in other people’s heads when you’re already being pretty clear in your description.
Edit: Not the link to my post, but the link I posted there, this one:
http://www.tentonhammer.com/articles/sandbox-mmos-vs-theme-park-mmos-fight
I don’t know if you play any Blizzard games at all, but one of the HotS devs at one point talked about this concept of “The Salt Wall” in terms of trying to balance characters. Basically, “The Salt Wall” is a point at which something is so out of balance, or feels so out of balance, that players complain about EVERYTHING related to the problem and it becomes impossible to figure out what is actually wrong/fix the problem. Due to the mid-game grind, I think a lot of people (myself to an extent as well) have hit that salt wall and are looking for solutions. A revamp to how tool progression works (making silver/gold useful on the way to titanium/diamond) could maybe fix the problem, re-working power and what needs it could maybe fix the problem, re-working footfall to help smaller players could maybe fix the problem, etc, but it’s hard for the devs to tell because people are complaining about so much stuff that it’s tough to pin down where exactly the failure is (and if there even is one).
Open discussion is one way to breach “The Salt Wall,” so I thank those of you that have engaged with me in serious discussion, even if you disagree with me. Thanks for being the community I hoped for when I started the game.
Edit: I don’t think it was a cynical move, no. But the devs did choose to make a voxel game and market it by showing awesome builds and saying “You can do anything, be anything” etc. That does imply there should be some sort of balance and the balance could be in the wrong spot.
Well, you still can. But that doesn’t mean that every one of the ‘things’ that ‘anything’ covers will be equally successful (or have equal difficulty) in all aspects of the game. Again, it’s a problem with expectations (or in some cases of wanting to have your cake and eat it too)
Can you play exclusively as a builder? You can. It will be much harder, because you’ll have to beg people for blocks since mining would violate your personal definition of ‘be anything’.
You could try to be a janitor, too, and go around from portal to portal asking if there’s anything that players have too much of that they want to get rid of.
It doesn’t mean that that particular playstyle will be as effective at obtaining oort stones as a hunter that does group meteor hunts constantly.
Edit: And yes, I have played several Blizz games, but not recently. (Quit WoW before the first expansion)
Keep footfall please.
The game economy is bad and that’s not new.
Since it’s a sandbox, you can skip it. It doesn’t prevent people to enjoy the remaining content.
I don’t understand why people are angry about it, just ignore the whole thing.
I never selled anything in early access.
Release is worse and more broken (to stay very polite 
). There is no fix possible at this point, but as said earlier, it doesn’t matter.
I’m surprised how close that vote is wow.
The people upset right now are those stuck at an iron level, in terms of sustainability. The options are either break yourself and burn out on the game using iron hammers to try to find enough gems to get coils and then repeat many times until you can finally make a hammer…
OR
Buy gems from other people. However prices are so knackered (edited from previously used language that reflected how I felt about the situation) right now because major cities have prices set for people who make considerable sums from footfall, not for the people stuck at iron.
The majority of people arguing for footfall are those who benefited from the early release and bomb mining for several months and already have full power coils and gems for days in stock.
The more we have this discussion, it is becoming clearer to me that footfall isn’t the real problem, though it could be changed to help combat symptoms.
Of course if you have 40 people meteor hunting, that group collectively will make more money than 2 people building houses on a river. That’s fine, that is currently this game’s form of “raiding” until later tier content is added. When I played WoW I didn’t raid and had no problems with people that did. That content just wasn’t for me. But that didn’t get in the way of the content that was for me, while in this game it feels like it does. Due to the mid-game grind (which I am more and more convinced is the main problem), it’s very difficult to continue progressing as a small group. If you like the grind, that’s fine, and generally I do, but this feels far too slow. The way to skip that grid in to buy the things you don’t have/can’t make, but to buy things you need income, which you can’t get as 2 people building houses on a river unless you have a portal to your house, and portals take power to make (which we are currently grinding towards, should maybe have it in, like, a month?) or money which we can’t generate (easily) without building in a city.
you can forge a bunch of iron hammers. Forge ingredients are pretty easy to get.
you can also go on several hunts and trade your non-diamond gems (rarer gems) for diamond (less rare), then make titanium tools with your coils and forge those too.
Pure boon compound 2 requires power now and pure boon compound 1 on an iron hammer is such low effectiveness you barely get a trait or two out of it, let alone an actual useful boon. And then there’s the whole reactive lamella thing to get the base to begin with.
This makes several assumptions that don’t fit the typical player stuck at iron. Either that they’re part of a group continuously hunting meteors on high level worlds or that they have access to food and skill points that allow them to solo handle meteors on high level worlds.
The difference, in my view, is the culture. Did you play WoW in the early days after release? I was a hunter.
It was the worst possible class to pick at the time but I thought pets looked cool (google ‘vanilla wow hunter deadzone’ at some point if you’re curious and weren’t around back then, it’s immaterial to the conversation) and it took me four months to get from level 30 to level 40 (it was a full pvp server and that was when you started to have to quest in full pvp maps).
That is to say, I have quite a high tolerance for this sort of thing, and things in boundless definitely should not be balanced around players like me or else we would have a population of about 10 people.
But I digress… as I was saying, the player culture here is different. People that are already established are fully able to empathize with the struggles of that mid-game wall, and many (myself included, as I suppose you’re well aware) are perfectly willing to help out, materially as well as with advice, the newer players struggling thru it, because this is not a competitive game.
Or, to put it in WoW terms, there’s no one here that will corpse-camp and t-bag you.
