Meant that this exploit james defined, was abused.
I would agree the teaching pies are being used in a way that was probably not as intended. I guess my question is, do teaching pies need to be active when you start the crafting or when you pick up the xp or both? because limiting the time it runs may not solve the problem.
Example - I load up the crafting tables go away from my build and logoff overnight. Then I logon in the morning eat the pie and go to my workshop to collect the xp. If the pie is only needed to pick it up then the exploit continues.
Example 2 - I eat the pie and queue up the machines. Logoff and come back in to collect the xp. If the pie only has to be active when I load the machines then the exploit continues.
Example 3 - I eat a pie, load the machines, go away from the workshop and log out. When I log back in I eat another pie and go back to the workshop and collect the xp. If you need the buff to start and pick up the xp then the exploit can still continue with the only change being it costs two pies versus 1.
The suggested fix would change pies to award bonus xp for the next Y xp, so time is no longer a variable.
2 Likes
A bit of math and good spacing would combat that pretty easily also
I like rock xp
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Fair enough, so does that mean we turn them into an early player tool versus a late game tool for leveling?
Depends, do we (or they) also tweak the recipe so it’s worth it to keep a pie active even at lvl 50? How much xp should the pie stay active for? I think it should scale with your current level like the death penalty debuff, so it’s always the same amount of pies you need for one level. Be it 1 or 5, whatever is deemed a good balance between the input resources and output xp.
And this is just one solution to fix the pies being used with crafting logout trick, there’s also the possibility (others can suggest alternatives too) of keeping the current 30min timer but letting it expire in sanctum/logout too, but I don’t think that’s a good solution. Stuff happens irl so you might lose the opportunity to take full advantage of it and be discouraged to use them.
@Simoyd Me too, but I don’t think a good solution to limit the (again, dev defined) exploit was found, so the devs are probably going to keep the nerf. Just trying to cope with it now 
So I’m thinking of ways to make it more bearable…
In general, I do not have a problem with changing the teaching foods. I would prefer not to make an over complicated system so that a pie does x for every player. I am ok with it only good for 20k xp. I just think we need to understand that it makes it more of an early game item then a late game item. I do agree if you make this change you keep the rest in tact.
I think the 30 minute timer is interesting but goes back to my earlier post, when does the teaching food have an effect, when you start the craft, when you pick up the xp or does it have to be active the entire time? If the entire time then you really limit what a pie can be used for as some items require more than 30 minutes to craft.
I wouldnt consider it an early game item at all, given the requirements to make them. Especially the pies. 20k is pretty useless. That would also require a recipe nerf if you plan to nerf the benefits
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That might be true. . the ingredients are not early game so, they might have to make changes. I would agree that except for the early levels or death penalty 20k is pretty useless.
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Right yeah, that question would still be relevant if we go the 30min path. I don’t know, all of the options can be abused, only if it had to be the same pie that’s active at start and end would the dev imposed condition be fulfilled. But it can still scale the pie to the heavens since crafting doesn’t have a limit for xp/h if you just spend enough time in the setup phase.
I myself would lean on the fixed xp version, I’m not using the pies right now since having one active while doing an activity would put a lot of pressure to min-max the activity to the limit before I’d justify using a pie.
edit:
@Venom
The lower ones do have easier recipes, the XP amounts could be balanced to make it viable early- and endgame maybe?
Solution to this whole problem - Don’t call it a problem and leave it as it is. Since it isn’t a problem. 
7 Likes
Why not just move the mass crafting epic to the highest unlocked section in the skill tree, or make a special one for it? That would place a llimit on it with minimal effect on new players.
BUT BUT BUT BUT…There is a problem! Muh Wood xp!? lol
we can also change your wood. . seems fair to me. .
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Powerleveling alts is an MMO staple. It’s a shame when someone advises a new player to skip the time and experience that are, IMO, where a player develops a love for a game. But it’s certainly not unique to boundless, and many people know this well enough to reject the advice anyways.
I mean, in an MMORPG style game with alts, that first play through is the gold. If the game is good, a second play through with your knowledge, trying the things you learned or thought of during the first play through can be great, too.
There quickly comes a time, though, when it’s like “hey I need a miner” and you’re honestly not interested in slogging it up through 30 - 50 hours of basic early game play with an incapable avatar AGAIN.
Even if the only thing available is giving them an endgame tool and having them blast out disproportionate activities for their level, people are going to power level their alts.
In my opinion the smoothest way to remove this from the balance of early game engagement is fully enable the behavior in such a way that it’s not attractive to a new player. In this way you can also address a bit of the economic problem, if there is one.
I posted in another thread about how a cheat loaf and some cheat level coffers could easiliy address this with or without distributing cubits.
If there’s not an economic problem, and there’s not a win condition - why are we having this conversation?
Please don’t take the top tier teaching buff and render it useless to top tier players because somebody can feed them to a new alt.
If “leveling too fast” is just some sort of game design problem, or control/gating issue for the devs and their design philosophy there certainly shouldn’t be leveling aids in the game. The buffs in boundless have similar constraints and behaviors to normal, common MMO buffs and buff timers pausing when you’re lobbied or disconnected is also normal.
It’s not wrecking every other game that has these features? My impression was that the teaching loaf was applicable for 30 minutes of play time, and that’s how it works.
If it’s just that the current time gating isn’t sufficient, maybe the solution to this problem is to pause the crafting machines while the avatar doing the crafting is not connected. It seems to hit all of the stated/desired points.
EDIT: I really don’t understand if ‘the devs’ don’t like alts, but they’re in the game anyways, and ‘the devs’ don’t like powerleveling, but they’re providing leveling aids - where are we headed here?
3 Likes
Changing XP or changing how pies work is not going to stop people from finding fastest way to level. The problem lies elsewhere, what is the reason we would want to do.it and have a look if something needs changing there
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But that would be a much bigger nerf than what they proposed now. I do many things on a teaching pie to gain XP faster, changing how they work would massively cut into the amount of.xp I can gain and thus also amount of plots, not a great solution in my opinion.
Also it would make teaching pies absolutely worthless to try to sell…
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Yeah it is I agree. But if we first buy into the fact that players are leveling too fast using pies, AOE tools and rock, (which I do not btw) then where do you make a change so that the meta does not just move to another crafting option? Personally, I would argue it hurts no one to leave it alone. But if they are going to change something I would prefer them not to change rock xp now and then brick and then furnaces and then whatever we come up with next.
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I agree it’s fine as it is
Underlying reasons why one wants to use those methods needs changing.
I rather like to use excess skillpoints to buy a level with for an alt, say 8 skillpoints for one level.
Other reason people do it is for plots so clearly people feel they don’t get enough, hence why I.proposed introducing a new plot related currency, instead of one plot you get 8 ‘plobits’, plots above and below an existing one can then.cost less, etc.