Join Mercatorum Aequitatis - the Boundless Guild for all "Merchants of Fairness!"

General
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I really do wish I could get through to you. I’d NEVER expect you to leave and would argue with you that you shouldn’t. You leaving helps no one. Consider, though, to just put down the identity or shield or whatever protection mindset you have right now and read my previous comment about risk statement as an outside observer (not shop owner) and talking about two shops that have a different belief and value statements on the wall. Which might buyers visit and why.

I can understand my original post and some of my other responses back were just too strongly worded for you. I’ll apologize if that helps. I don’t know you at all, so I have no context on how to get through to you and help you see the goal of this idea. Maybe you are fearing that I’m actually trying to put you out of business in the game - I’m not. Tell me where your shop is with location coords and I’ll visit.

If we were to start over between us and you read my original post, consider this: Do you believe prices should take the most money from beginners and those with lower funds OR be stable enough with minimal profit that everyone has a possibility to buy the product?

If you are of the mindset of the LATTER view point then the Mercatorum Aequitatis would completely be a fit for you.

We are there to really provide service to the customer so why not join together as a group of sellers trying to provide the best products to the community? It hurts no one really to have that transparency. Those that are NOT in the guild can still 100% be fair and give great services - that decision really is just between them and the buyer. Good service = good profits and notoriety. The guild idea is just a group of people 100% committed and willing to stake their reputation on that in a “group oriented way” and providing a more visible marketing process in it.

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Well said and accurate! Agreed!

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I don’t believe in either of these. I believe that a market should be ran by market economics, not by you and “a group of trusted people” deciding what is a fair price. You’re not talking anymore about a market. You want to take EVERYTHING that is a market, out of the market.

I’m sorry to be blunt, but at that point why not make everything free and just stop doing a market at all? There’s no free market if the market is controlled by an organization.

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So I wasn’t going to keep answering here - however this is why I think it’s important for having access to good information. Things you might think are commonplace knowledge, aren’t. I have no idea how forging works, so I have no idea how much goes into the raw materials to make the base compounds. I’ve spoken to other long term players who don’t know that you need to make a couple of mass craft of boost oil in order to have enough oil to make a mass craft of mega fast brew for eg. (the constant need for saltpetre is why I put my hand up to take over Bob’s saltpetre mine on Alcyon, and keep it open for everyone.)

Everything in this game takes a lot of grind to get. Each item has multiple steps. Want to make a gem tool? You need leather. That’s not just hides, but hides and kranuts. Easiest way to get kranuts? Build a farm - but then you have to harvest and replant, which gives no XP and is extremely time consuming. Newbies need to know that some things are expensive because they take a lot of time to gather and craft the items that go into them.They need to know that there is a difference between someone raising prices artificially as happened with oortstone, and someone making a fair profit.

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I’m gonna stop replying to this thread after this because i’m clearly unstable right now. But I do want to mention this. Fair profit keeps being mentioned here. As xaldafax mentioned earlier, that means “minimal profit” apparently. That means my shop, based on that reasoning, automatically will not be allowed to join because I choose to price my forged tools in a way so i don’t sell out constantly, and are therefore more expensive than average market value.

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Whereas I think that needs to be factored in - as players we need to be able to also enjoy the game - not just be tied to constantly gathering materials, crafting or forging, only for someone to come in and buy out everything. That’s a sure way to bring on player burn out.

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How much are your forged tools and where is your store? I’m currently learning to forge and interested in how to price them. Got no clue currently set to 15k

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Heh, market average is between 10 - 12k at the moment for t6’s. I’m the Raxxa world hub, easy to find. I’m sitting at the high end of that average.

Hard to exactly say how much my tools are though, because i’m selling SO MANY DIFFERENT things lmao

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I know this topic’s a bit hot-button right now, but I feel like making a proposal.

I feel like making it guild-only would be unnecessarily restrictive and possibly even a power funnel (although I do believe there were good intentions [albeit with unclear wording] with the original proposal)

Without a guild, anyone could slap the label “Mercatorum Aequitatis” on their shop and call themselves “Good” no matter their pricings and behavior. And without a clear way of contacting each other and working things out …

Where do we meet in the middle? A mega-thread?

Now introducing: the Thread Proposal

“Listings”
A thread is put up here for each “Listing”
Viewable by anyone and containing the shop name and world, or even contact info so people can go find a message box and talk. No guild required, possibly not even a forum account (acct for convenience’s sake only.)

Buyers could put out requests for bulk item buys as well .

To keep track of who’s buying, listing it with the listing is an optional idea, but I can see that it could easily go wrong .

“Buyer/Seller”
In their own beacon, as a result of a message, they arrange a meetup with the customer in a restricted area. Either by a hand-trade or a restricted shop stand, or even a location token+shop stand permissions if they’ve proven exceptionally faithful (although it is dangerous to the owner) .

The customer gets to buy cheaper materials. Either in-bulk or for little refuels. This will maintain a private network of shops and players buying and selling untouched by price gouging .

If the buyer abuses their priveleges and sells directly to the public network (monitor via BUTT)? It was restricted anyways so they can be kicked out (seller blacklists) for free .

If a buyer buys from the private network to make things and sells those crafts on the public network? If the seller doesn’t appreciate it, or if there’s no way to access them for cheaper on the private network, the seller can stop selling .

If a buyer makes a location token on that spot (shop stand) to continue buying without permission? That’s what locks are for. Imagine a shop stand in a locked steeeel trapdoor casing, permission to buy granted by seller only. Auto-closing. Better, isn’t it ?

If (insert repeated bad behavior here), others can blacklist from their own parts of the network. If someone keeps selling to a bad actor, they can be blacklisted by others in their buy chain. I do NOT agree with public forum shaming, so if something has to be discussed, privately with the network’s people and with proof. Shaming/Libel is also bad behavior .

The seller can sell at a higher price on their own shop stands that aren’t within the system, keeping the free market intact, and you don’t have to be part of a private guild to do so. Prices don’t even need to be truly enforced. People aren’t going to do all those extra steps to buy if there’s no real benefit from doing so.

If you’ve spotted any more holes in my idea, let me know! I’m receptive and willing to make a revised charter (maybe even scrap it altogether). I probably will rewrite it regardless, for the sake of a true binding/honor/legal code for the shops when everything’s ironed out.

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One problem that will cause a hold up on this eventually even with people that have gleam club the max amount will stop going up for max players to join. What happens then when the max is reached and no one else can join? A guild can only have so many people in it.

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I guess I have read different market economics books than you. As for “free” stuff, I never said I was interested or was really trying to do that. But loss leaders is a good way to drive business and also help new people. I might consider that… Lastly, there is ALWAYS a free market even when people control everything. But, going forward I will stop trying to close the gap between us.

Of course - information is critical to all players. As I said before this idea was not ever going to be about managing and controlling every price and component, it was about the former not latter. That wouldn’t work anyway and am not interested in trying to make the guild my job or require that of people.

I put the idea behind a guild because it is the easiest way to manage people and centralize who was part of the agreement and who wasn’t. It wasn’t a power grab or anything like everyone keeps thinking.

Attempting to steal my guild name or stuff like that will be reported to the Devs for banning.

If you don’t like my idea or want to help try to improve the shopping experience for new players or those having issues with funds then that is ok. I’m not requiring you or anyone to try to help people or the game. But, please take your “own proposals” to another thread. What you are trying to do is NOT related to this topic.

Yes, I’m aware of that limitation. In the initial post I mentioned there are a few challenges and this was the best options I had until future Development could continue. The good news was the game isn’t super popular so we weren’t going to max out that many in the guild with people using just 1 account. Factions were supposed to help with that but the Devs messed it up so we just have a limit for now.

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If you are interested in how simple it is to convert an existing stall or small area to a guild shop as well as how easy it is to integrate into an existing build come visit: Sine Qua Non [ Beckon, location: 1041N 759E ].

This shop shows clearly the minimal requirements needed to be a member and promote the overall goal of the guild without impacting any of your existing operations. Also, the settlement Prestige is not impacted. I’m still getting all the same prestige assigned to my account in the larger settlement that was there before. The “guild” prestige is still supporting the larger settlement so it stays ranked in the world the same.

I’ll be working on another shop but I wanted to show how easy it is to just flip an area and support the concept of providing a centralized location that supports the guild concept. Reminder this was never about putting other shops out of business or competing on every piece of product. Maybe it is the real world today that causes this, but people were way too critical or fearful of a simple idea to help solve challenges people face in our current shopping landscape. I will work to edit the original post soon to clarify a few things and bring in the constructive comments that were received.

I greatly appreciate those that reached out privately for more information and their interest in the idea. Thank you @boundmore in being the first willing to step up and join as well as publicly state via his own Guild Shop that he believe in Mercatorum Aequitatis’ values and goals of helping improve the buyer experience and access to goods across Boundless.

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Yes indeed I have built a shop on my sovereign and put some oort there. We will make an editable list of locations with directions for any future members to be able to find the shops and get rough oort and shards at premium prices.

The aim is to always offer prices around market’s top 3, thus adding to existing pool of shops trying their best to be affordable.

The member-only policy is there to avoid being bought out by market players and to get to buyers who really need oort for their portals rather than vanity or profiteering.

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Here’s a thought… Everyone talking about how this is a nice community of nice people with good intentions…then put your money where your mouth is, so to speak, just ask people to cooperate with the plan, why would the “force-feeding a guild rammed down our throats” be necessary? I consider myself to a basically nice person cough so if someone asks me to cooperate voluntarily for the good of the economy/community, I would. But once someone tells me I have to join a guild/club/clan/cult in order to have access to food and water (figuratively speaking) my reaction is to give directions to the nearest access point to stick that guild., it’s a dark place where the sun doesn’t shine.Other than that this topic is giving me a headache.

(yes, I’m cranky today)

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no one is forcing anyone to do anything
and it’s not necessary - it’s a proposition and one presented with full transparency

you have access to everything outside this or any other guild

If I find 5 people who need help with oort pretty much all the time and want to help them, I can visit them every now and then and drop some stuff for them for free or at some discount prices. If I want to avoid looking for them and coordinating playing times across different time zones, I might set a few chests or shop stands for them and lock access to them specifically.
These things are happening already and many individuals and guilds offer access to cheap or free stuff to their members. Somehow no one is getting upset about it.

This is not different - this is made to offer (those who are interested) a place to get rough oort at best prices without arranging individual meetings all the time. So, shop stands. And to make sure stuff gets to the people that asked for help, the access will be given to those who sign up.

It’s not done for profit or power grab - this guild is not a primary guild for anyone and rather a side set up allowing exchange of goods between parties that agreed to distribute resources in controlled matter. An experiment that I am really surprised to see some people see in such negative light :man_shrugging:

It’s like giving someone keys to your storage so they can get some stuff without need to meet you every time it happens. Guild mechanics combined with lock mechanics allows it to avoid easy abuse of sharing idea. The giving party makes sure they control amounts handed out, and the receiving party knows stuff will wait for them without random finders clearing out everything.

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Im for trying anything new and I’m sure it’s been thought of, but pretty easy to abuse.

Someone could very well join the guild as an alt buy the items cheap, transfer them to another toon and resell it at a higher price. I had considered joining until I fully thought it out.

I’m not against it, but I do think the way it was originally presented sounded pretty sketchy which I am sure was a little misunderstanding and nothing against @Xaldafax as I am sure he means well. I also think if this already happening having a guild isn’t necessary, but who am I to say you can’t make a guild for whatever reason.

I do understand how this could force others outside this guild to have to lower their prices in order to remain competitive, but if we are just talking about rough oort and oort shards then I don’t really see the issue.

Then again, I see both sides and someone even outside this guild could lower their prices and force everyone else to sell cheaper. That’s pretty much what happened with the Oort already it just took @majorvex to be the catalyst.

What I liked about this last effort of oort prices being lowered, it was a very large community effort, I saw people running around buying and selling oort to get the prices down to 375c heck a few of us were competing to just buy someone out of oort to do it.

I’d much prefer a concerted effort to bring prices down as a community as I think overall thats more widely supported.

EDIT: If you happen to need Oort just let me know I’ll see what I can do to make sure you have it.

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that’s why we won’t accept people automatically - there is no official announcement of rules yet, but the idea is that those applying will be asked to provide information like their user name and list of alts as well as were their home beacon is so we can visit talk and have a chance to minimize abuse by seeing with own eyes that someone really looks legit

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I get it … I wish you luck on the endeavor. Boundless doesn’t have the tools to prevent the abuse.

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and at the same time it is a lot of running and effort
also, to avoid large amounts of oort being bought by in one go by some profiteer, I noticed now the shop stands involved have small amounts available

@Xaldafax idea was clear to me right away - what if we coordinate, make it easier and safer by using guild and lock mechanics

so, it’s not about creating an almighty guild of big shots, it’s about using guild mechanics for an idea that connects people from different guilds and worlds

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That is good it makes it take a lot of effort for some reseller to buy it and resell it. I see bigger amounts every couple days and that’s good. Keeping the buy price down just above sell all so helps.

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