How about the more tools you forge the fewer quirks you get? With experience you get better at making the tools. As you forge more the RNG factor drops until once you forge 100 hammers, you get what you expect everytime.
That would be my suggestion.
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Wouldn’t that be more akin to grinding levels as opposed to “skill”?
That’s like saying a level 50 player is more skillful than a level 25 player, but just because he has more skill-points dosen’t necessarily make that true
It is more akin to grinding I guess, but the only other way I can think of is to gate the forge by type of tool.
You will have to forge 25 wood hammers to be able to forge iron, 25 iron hammers to forge gold, 10 gold to forge titanium, 25 titanium to forge gem, 50 gem to forge rare (blink, rfit, umbris). I always think of skill as something that develops over time as you practice performing a task. So I am not sure it would not always seem the same as leveling.
I know the intent with the forge was for players to start forging with the lower level tools and move up to gem. So maybe this would reinforce the way they wanted it used and we might find the lower level tools useful for some tasks?
I would also be good with just removing RNG completely and letting anyone that has the skills and the resources forge the tools, but I think there would be a lot of push back on this.
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I think you are confusing player skill with character skill. The forge is meant to require player skill. You progression is you as a player get better at managing the RNG, and knowing how to handle it when things don’t go your way. Without the RNG, forging becomes like any other craft in the game: follow the optimal recipie, and you put in the same inputs, go through the same steps, and get the same outputs every time. All skill is removed.
Because dealing with the RNG is the thing that makes forging skill-based, it is important that the most desirable forged item, 3x3 hammers, have the most RNG. That is why it is good that magnet is on the same gum as AoE and it is good that AoE is the only boon that you have to stop at a certain level and not level up more as opposed to blindly dumping in as many points as possible.
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Id be interested to see your method. What i think im hearing you say is youre doing all the right things and still getting bad results more often than not, so the system is broken.
That seems really odd to me because ive forged about 15 things just today with almost all good results. And im really not that lucky.
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Yeah, i forge as well. I think the rng issues may be a bit of confirmation bias. I.e. we pay far more attention to the strings of bad luck than good. I can say that I do get some epicly BAD luck sometimes. And it hurts. When judging a particular method i personally reserve judgement until about 30 times through it. Thats about the minimum I feel comfortable with in order to understand what that method is going to produce. I currently do not feel that forging is excessively unbalanced. And because of the large amount of time it takes to get statistical results, and the near impossibility of it due to unique decisions that have to be made in the process. I think it is really really hard to tweek the forge system. I would be inclined to change the system a little though. There is a similar thread here:
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I do enjoy the challenge of the forge, but I’m able to get pretty consistent results. What @Kal-El was mentioning does sound a bit more like grinding to me. You’re not getting better at forging, you’re just doing more of it.
The lower efficiency on the new tools prove that it takes player skill to forge these higher end objects. As well as having the right deck. It’s a lot of trial and error. I think having a “testing” forge might be more beneficial. And maybe an actual walkthrough in game that shows you how to start doing some lower end stuff effectively.
Being able to unlock special abilities that allow you to either remove quirks or even change them could be great. There are some great quirks out there. That would allow character progression within the forge and would help reduce rng.
Alternatively, make roadrunner feathers drop more often so you can just make the boon transmute solvent instead… that really eliminates a lot of the rng, but is an expensive process to do currently.
A test forge in the game, or an option for “test mode” on the forge might be interesting. Perhaps you can set that on your forge and it would act as normal but not actually use the mats or forge the item.
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I mostly agree with you here.
A suggestion for the OP…
I usually don’t want the magnet boom either so what I do is either grab a boon transmute solvent to put in my forge deck or use deconstruction resin 3 if I don’t get what I want and try again.
This is where we probably disagree. I think that again all forging requires is a guide that says when x happens do y. That to me is not skill. Skill is something that requires practice to get right and then once you have mastered the skill, you should get consistent results.
To me as soon as you introduce something that is entirely random, then you eliminate skill. For example I have developed a skill in RL cooking. Through experience, I know how long something takes to make and cook and no longer have a 50/50 chance of something not turning out. I can follow a recipe (if necessary) and understand the terms used. My oven does not have a RNG that randomly adjusts the temperature.
But I apologize to the Op I have dragged this way off topic.
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I agree with the OP on this one. That magnet is total BS. Nobody wants that ■■■■. And I certainly do not agree with any of you who say “Dur it has to be hard” I mean really gtfo with that. This game should be hard but that doesn’t mean you should walk around with half baked weapons and tools that nobody actually wants to use. That centraforge is riddled with issues and this magnet is just a small one, its waste after waste after waste with it. When I have to deconstruct the same 5 tools 7-8 tiomes because that stupid magnet wants to keep popping up it is beyond frustration. I actually hate the devs at that point and want to bash them on these forums every chance I get because of how inconsiderate they are to our time and effort. We don’t have to play this and these devs should be happy that we are wasting literal life on this game but instead they screw us over and over and over. This last planet from yesterday is proof positive, made us wait days to slap us in the face.
If the centraforge was actually RNG instead of just programmed to screw you over like it actually was it would actually be alot more fair. But when I use a boon compound 3 on say a titanium tool and it lands on the same spot every time then I cannot believe this is RNG. I can actually predict what a compound will; do and it still leads to constant waste. Then if you use boon removal the thing will put the same stat right back on further adding insult to “injury”
This centraforge has caused me to contemplate quitting many times and it’s because we are forced into ■■■■ weapons and tools that nobody wants, nobody buys and now we’re supposed to toss it in a converting machine to get pennies on the dollar? No thanks.
Fix this stupid forge or get rid of it and let people craft what they want. Tools and weapons that people want to use should not be the variable but the guarantee. Let the mobs be the hard part.
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Boon. Transmute. Solvent.
Get that magnetic to level 3 then transmute that baby and boom, you automatically have a level 4 aoe boon.
We’ve been keeping track across almost all the forges we make, and we make a ton in my guild. Over a large enough sample size, yes, it is pretty equivalent. We just remember the times we hate more then the times we like with it.
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Forging requires no real player skill, just basic knowledge and a step by step procedure with a couple caveat rules. You can make a flowchart to get the best possible chance at a specific outcome, and a flow chart isn’t really player skill.
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Organizational skills are skills. It can be developed and improved upon.
Then why do we have some players complaining it is too hard while others consistently get the results they want? What separates those players of not skill? Knowledge of a system and ability to apply that knowledge as well as to adapt when things don’t go to plan is skill imo.
I think what separates those players is RNG. If you follow the rules and still end up with more bad then good, then that is how the system might work for a particular player. Random means that every time I roll I have the very same chance of getting a bad roll. It does not mean that I will always get 1 bad for every 9 good rolls.
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I think what Peregrine is saying that maybe the wrong rule-set is being followed.
There is a lot of ways to minimize rng. Even down further then 10%. Which means that its definitely possible to make 10 rolls with only one being bad. With deconstruct 3 it’s even easier minimize the lost on all but the most expensive of recipes.
Not sure. Most people that I hear complaining isn’t that its to hard, but that it requires extra time to farm mats to make up for getting poor rng. But I’ve also stopped being part of the greater boundless community, so maybe there are a ton of people who have issues getting the basic knowledge for forging. 
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I think this may be the main issue. Having a practice forge would even help experienced forgers in trying out new recipes without the drawback.
It is possible but not a sure thing. You could get 30 rolls that are good in a row, or 30 rolls in a row that are bad. That is the way RNG works. I do acknowledge, there are ways to minimize the chance of a bad roll, but I still do not understand (nor will I) why RNG adds any real value to the game.
edited for clarity
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