Market and Mall owners treated unfairly - contracts should be allowed

I don’t like people telling me how to Boundless, so I’m not going to do it with others. I agree no one likes a dead store, and the kind thing to do would be not to get a shop you can’t keep stocked. And if you do have a shop you can’t keep up, then you should let it go and give the plots to someone.

But, we all get busy and many have good intentions. It’s a game and it’s supposed to be fun and stress free…

Eventually, beacons die and new people move in. (Plot 8 in Trior Coop is vacant… :wink:) so, in that way I choose not to let it get to me.

I was thinking along the line of approximately three months. That is enough time for a player, generally, to have popped in and send a message that such and such has happened and they have to take time off.

I belong to another discord and we have had players who have had crisis happen and the majority have sent in a message either they themselves or even had a family member, son, daughter, partner to state such has happened. One person was in a life threatening accident yet her husband took the time to state that she was in the hospital, on life support, may not make it and didn’t know how long. I don’t remember how long it took and we didn’t hear for quite some time but she survived and was able to fully recover.
Another also ended up in the hospital, had complications and her son came on the day she was admitted and said mom’s in the hospital, don’t know how long. She was able to get on for a few minutes a few days later to state fell and broke my leg and injured my back, have to have surgery, be out for a while.

If a player can show up to get their footfall, they can post a message to someone that this has happened.

This is a different situation, maybe I am being too harsh, but I see both sides and for a large mall it may be easier, but you are hurting others by not being willing to pull out and let someone have your place. There are always malls, markets, shopping centers opening up, we just had several mentioned here on this forum of new mall, markets and more, be generous, nice, considerate and don’t hurt others in what I see as selfish and perhaps intentional spiteful behavior in staying in a shop area that others can use. The sites at the malls, at the markets could be closer and easier for that player to set up a shop in.

Maybe because my father owned three businesses, I learned quickly that you don’t hang on when you aren’t making money. He didn’t make a lot of money, but we did have enough to do okay,

This is a game, but in some ways, we play as if it is real and thinking of others, not just of yourself is important, at least to me. In a game where you play with others it affect them and it bleeds over into their real life that to me is inconsiderate, mean hearted (when done intentionally) and unfair to others.

I would have no problem if I stopped playing and @AeneaGames took my shop down, stored my items and let someone else have that spot, that to me is fair, I made a commitment and didn’t keep it, at least she would be considerate enough to store my belongings for me and let another player have a spot so they could make “money”.

I do understand @majorvex side, and I see her viewpoint and why she feels that way and that is great of her that she can be like that, I don’t agree with her, but I respect her right as it is her mall and she can run it however she wants.

Part of the problem is, we don’t know when a player has quit and plans to never return, if they had uninstalled the game and consider it a loss of money and won’t be back. But that shop, that road they build, that base that is sitting there with a GC beacon that will run for the year they paid for will keep another player from getting a prime location whether in a mall or near a city that others would love to have.

I have been playing this game for almost 10 months, that is pretty close to a year and I feel that if you have played for three months and have not ever put down a stand, returned to stock your stands, made no contact with the mall or market “owners” of what is going on, even just a line of “taking a break will be back in six months” you have given up the rights to have a shop there. But, that is my feelings and no one has to agree with me.

Gave two bases away to new players, told them they had three months to get plots to replace my plots, that I wanted the plots back, they could keep everything in it. Three months were up, tried to reach them, no contact, sent messages, no response. Sent messages of two weeks notice and I was removing the plots, tearing down the bases and taking what was there put it in storage, they had another month. They removed their first base, so I go they quit, they no longer have the right to my plots or what I gave them or what they left.

Harsh, maybe, but they gave up that right when they did not contact me any during that time, no message even here on the forum.

I feel a three month notice is enough, some will go it should be longer, some should be left alone and not touched, that is for each mall, market, or shopping area owners to decide, but I feel they should have the right to remove what has been left and no contact after three months and put in storage for another period of time, how long would depend on how much storage the owner will have.

Or just go to aquas sunken mall.
We dont wait for things come into the game… we invent them.

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If you save/collect someone’s expired things & wait to see if they come back - that’s a :heartpulse: nice, courteous thing that you’re doing imo. You have every right to set a time limit on how long you are willing to hold those items.

In MMOs, people will come & people will go. People generally play MMOs off & on for many years. A lot will take large breaks. Sometimes we’ll be surprised at who lets their places go/expire. You never know what’s going on with someone. If you’ve been playing a game with someone for awhile & they go M.I.A, I think we get genuinely concerned & curious as to if a person is ok, what is going on, etc. It’s nice if they come back or if they pop in and let everyone know they’re ok & maybe what’s going on (but they don’t have to).

I would hope that people don’t feel stressed or pressure to login to a game to give an update about their IRL situation if it’s really bad. Sometimes people just move on from a game. Sometimes they need to take a break & do something else. Sometimes they have a lot going on & need to put all of their attention & energy into what they are dealing with.

We’d love for things to never change & people to never leave, but things happen & change is inevitable.

Even if I had a brain fart one day & decided to go all gangsta on everyone in the mall…what can I really do? Nothing really. With our current permissions/beacons/abilities, there’s not much I can do. And no one would want to play with someone that is always judging what they are doing or telling them what/how/when to do it.

I don’t know what the right solution is to the whole empty-shops-and-abandoned-places issue. Abandoned places do expire eventually or get taken by someone else. Maybe BL could consider adding few NPCs or some type of universal market menu that we can use to buy/sell/trade - and remove some of the difficulty of trying to find items that we want to buy. I dunno. Maybe they have something planned after the roadmap is complete. I couldn’t say :woman_shrugging:

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o6bb8jjx8or0

just did sugestion on this
i hope the aquatopia sunken town mall system can show the dev’s what we need
i forwarded all details to our system to the dev’s i hope they come see how they can make it less off a pain to setup a system to improve mall’s

You know, I would already be happy if beacons in markets/malls do have a different set of rules where after the shop owner not visiting for xx amount of time the beacon ownership reverts back to the market/mall owner. Then the items can get stored for when the shopkeeper comes back one day.

Problem is that right now people can stop playing even tho they have months (or years in one case in New Leyden) of Gleam Club and the empty shop is just sitting there. I absolutely get that real life can get in the way, heck I know that very well actually, but I would like it if people would at least share they won’t be around for a while. I also don’t mind people then needing months to get back to an active shop and keep it around for that long, just wish I knew what was going on. Of course I get that when certain things happen a game can be the least of your worries, but let’s face it, plenty of times they just decided to take a break and just didn’t share it…

So these new beacon rules is just for the cases where people don’t get around to telling people what’s up whatever the reason may be…

It sure would be nice if the beacons of dead shops at the Waterfront Outlets would just expire. Or any mall for that matter :expressionless:
People who just quit playing and for some reason their beacon still wont expire

The problem with all of this is how does the system know that someone is taking a break and let the person running the mall know or they did not let them know? There is not a way for the game to know what communications happened between players so do you end up giving the person who set up the mall the ability to remove a persons beacon, really for any reason they choose? Why should the game give any player the ability to remove the plots of another? If they fueled their beacon then did they not follow the rules of the game? If you give another player this ability to remove another’s beacon, what happens to what they had in the store?

Why is running a mall any different than any build in the game where players have to cooperate and sometimes people are people and for whatever reason they fail to do what they said they would do? Do you let the warden of a town have the same ability? So when I decide that I do not like what someone built, I just remove their beacon and they have no recourse?

I think this gets very bad very quickly. This is an MMO and we have to deal with other people and unless they are breaking the CoC, we will sometimes be disappointed in some of them. Any player that decides to engage in a cooperative venture be that a mall, settlement, or whatever is taking a certain risk.

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how you feel about my suggestion to have a alternative guild to run beacons the mall owner owns himself so nobody gets kicked off his land cause they dont own the land then they sorta sign a contract that they agree on eviction when owner feels like it
@Kal-El

As I mentioned in that same post when a the shop owner hasn’t visited their own shop in xx amount of time the beacon reverts back to mall/market owner. If they have contacted the mall/market owner it can be just left there until they come back and beacon ownership can be transfered again.

I don’t see an issue with this at all. For the game it’s easy to determine if shopowner visited or not, it is already being tracked for footfall purposes anyway.

Only ‘scary’ thing left is trusting market/mall owner to keep the materials safe. Not sure why this would be a big issue and why you think it would be abused. Even if something on towards happens with the contents that’s only after shop keeper hasn’t visited their own shop for a while and which would then be something people learn quickly about that mall/market…

And no, it’s not deleting someone else’s beacon, the beacon is basically rented but original owner, market or mall owner, gives up any and all perms like its not theirs anymore UNTIL the shop keeper doesn’t visit the shop, then it reverts back…

Sure a system like this can be done already but then shop keepers never get perms as if they own the beacon. Just like the Aqua mall are doing now already, ha ent hwaes anything bad happend their either…

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Towns and hubs have this problem too. How would the game differentiate a mall, City, or Hub from other builds?

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Personally I do not like it. It still lets one player decide for another if they get to stay or not and it is totally arbitrary as to why they can do it. So lets say you let a player have a market stall and then a friend of yours joins the game, you can kick the other player out and they have no recourse. I think this can create a lot of dissatisfaction for players. You still have the player that was kicked out loosing all the effort they went into running a store as well as everything they built into the stall.

I understand the frustration in having someone not do what they said they would and how this can impact other players in the game. But in the end it is a game and an MMO we are not going to like everything other players do.

So we want to make players not only refuel their own beacons, but also if they are part of a group build they have to make sure they actually log in every so often or they loose their stuff? And this does nothing to make sure that a shop is actually stocked. All it means is they visit. How is an empty shop any better for a mall than one where an owner never visits? I am not sure there is really any difference. Or are you now going to have to introduce a mechanic that says they have to keep items on stands. I guess I see this as a cycle that never ends. The mall owners are never going to be happy when an individual does not do what they said they would.

Of course it can be abused. You and both know that players in this game have worked every angle to “get ahead” and even if the mall runner does develop a bad rep, how can you communicate that? It is against the CoC to name and shame and even if they could how does that help the player that lost everything? It does not, so another player quits the game because they were taken advantage of due to a mechanic that is really not needed in the game.

Ok so because one person (@the-moebius) can be trusted, we should trust every other player in the game? I do not think that is really a good argument to make. We both know from personal experience that players will lie and not do what they said. I guess it still comes down to why are we shifting the trust from the mall owner to the player that wants to have a stall in the mall? .

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You would then end up having to add rules about how much inventory is in the stands and the prices. If somebody gets mad about having to stock their store when they don’t want to they could put one grass seed on each stand for 99999999. I think James and the team would end up with a lot more complaints. A lot of the negative comments in regards to the game are directed at expiring beacons and fueling beacons as it is. To add an extra layer to that which involves someone’s money/shop would just be gasoline on the fire in my opinion

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There are no footfall traps in Gyosha Mall. I will gladly stick up for every single merchant that is in the mall - including you & your shop. I hope you rec’d extra sales/footfall from the free 7 day portal that we put in front of your shop recently.

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I know that I go past shops that have the same empty stands, or have one or two items. That items are at the back of the shop and you Have to enter to see what is there and it may be just one item.

It is just my personal opinion, and has nothing to do with you, shop, mall, market and other owners have NO Control over what is done in a shop, how the player treats it or even if they every come back.

@majorvex You can’t control anyone who sets up a footfall trap, it isn’t on you. It is on the shop owner, not the malls or markets owners for the footfall traps. Reserved shop plots have sat empty for months, which is unfair, in my opinion, to a player who wants to be closer to the front. I can sound harsh, but to me a spade is a spade and someone who uses shops to just get footfall are in the wrong and it should not be allowed. Something needs to be done, but what and how are the most important questions.

Maybe I am being too harsh, but I feel that many of such shops that don’t restock, that visit just to pick up footfall, are using it for a footfall trap and that should not be allowed, those who want a spot lose out. And the mall and market owners and others have shopping area are and will deal with this, those who are greedy and care only about themselves will continue to do what they can to get coins.

I have taken my shop down, After starting this topic I feel I am one of those players, I am lucky to sell anything, most days I get no footfall, or just a few coins, less than 100 coins. My son, he never checks his shop, has no interest in playing the game as he feels it was false in the advertisement of what was in the game, the new content has not been anything he wants, he is not a builder and feels that many of the recipes have become complex to, well, be busy work, not of value. I agree somewhat, but I enjoy the game enough to overlook most of it.

At G. Mall, many days zilch, at the most on a good week close to 1k coins, usually less. At NL Market I was making from 3k to 6k coins a Day. At NG Market, it is 10k to 15k coins a day many days, some less, but that is when I have been unable to restock due to health issues.

I want to see mall, market and other such type of setups be protected from those who are using them as a footfall trap. And to me, that is what those type are, traps to get coins and not work.

That hurts the malls, market and other owners and shop owners in many ways, loss of coin from players who stop going as they can’t find what they want. Negative remarks from them to others of how that place doesn’t have anything any more and so why go there.

I don’t have time to run around a business that has empty shops, shops that I see as footfall traps, sell very few items and don’t restock just so they can get coins, And I have seen them eventually close.

I’m not saying players who have a legitimate reason should lose out, but neither should the mall, market and other owners lose out.

I started this topic to get feedback on should contracts be allowed, what are other suggestions to protect these mall, market and other places from such treatment.

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the thing with a contract system i cant work out tho is how much des the game deal with and how much is dealt with on a player level has it has been mentioned before if a term of the contract is too just have “stocked” stands then its easy to have a few shop stands filled with 9,000,000 a piace dirt blocks and im a little hesitant to give to much power to the shop or mall keep cuz then you run the risk of someone losing there shop and everything they got in it over drama or out of game things.

I see your point, and others such as @ginabean but I am thinking of them of how it can and does hurt them.

I’m not going give them two day, two weeks, but at the least three months for them to contact you. If you take down their shop and put their items into storage and they can get it back that is fair.

Yes, they can take a chance that the mall, market and other owners will use their not being in contact as a excuse to steal their items, but the also take the chance that the shop owner is using them for free footfall.

There needs to be a security system, and I am hoping that those who read this topic can offer some. A video recording of them agreeing to keep it restocked maybe to a certain percentage, Example 25% restocked once a week, to informed them after three months if something has happened so the owner can make a decision on what to do.

As I stated one time, I am in a few other discords, and they are in some ways gaming discords in that there are several games that they can play with the Content Creator, GameEdged is one of them, he has several games in areas for members to play, sometimes even with him.

Just about everyone is nice to each other, many who have had a crisis, and it isn’t required, have come on and stated, such and such has happened, can’t play, can’t post, can’t help out. They don’t have to and some don’t. But many do take the time, wife was in accident, on life-support, may not live. It was months before we heard anything, but she did live and almost full recovery. Son came on, mom fell down the stairs, broke her leg, found some damage to her back, surgery, she wanted me to let you all know.

They took the time in a crisis to say I can’t be there. Players can make the time at some point. Ones who have quit probably won’t and if they have GC it can be really hard to know if it was a crisis or they just quit and don’t plan on coming back.

Protect the mall, market, and other owners of the place so they can store the items. A contract that is binding to both, to protect both. I’m hoping for suggestions, not outrage at what is seen as trying to destroy the game.

Three months, five months, six months, what would be a good time to set as a limit, how often should they be required to visit and restock, and not just visit once a week to get footfall, if they can do that, they can bring some items to put on the stands in my opinion. They have created a footfall trap and deserve to be tossed out, harsh, but that is what I see it as.

If I were to have a heart attack and my hubby or son didn’t contact @AeneaGames and let her know that I’m not able to play (and they wouldn’t both won’t talk to others on the phone unless they have no choice, I have to do it all – social phobic), she can take my shop down, store my stuff so another player can have that spot, that is only fair to her and those who want that site.

Suggestions on how can mall, market and other owners be protected from being used by players, if a contract, how and what should be in it, if not one, what do you think could be done to help them.

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It’s not a perfect solution, but I am hoping others can have a idea of what can be done, how it can be set up.

I don’t like it in a way, but in another way I hate seeing the mall, market and others being take advantage of and nothing can be done to protect them.

There are plenty of threads of griefing, hunts are having problems, discussions are in what can be done to help with it. The damage here isn’t as obvious, but it is there.

It is possible nothing can be done, the mall, market and others owners will have to just suffer from the players taking advantage of them, and I’m not talking about a legitimate situation, but the abuses that have and do happen.

Anyone who wants to find a way to trick the system will, but there will be some who will understand and have no problem with it. We can’t stop all the griefing, the abuse of the freedom of this game, but can we create something to help with the problems, to some extent? Is it even possible? I don’t know,

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Firstly, one thing I would like to say to others is that there’s no point fear-mongering about a system like this being added to the game. In the way @Janna55 describes the system, I would take it as a system that is
optional and that would actually need to be willingly setup by the market/mall owners and willingly used by the people that wanted to use that same economic area.

With a system like this, malls and markets as they exist now wouldn’t suddenly disappear as a result of an optional contract/rent system for shops… They would simply exist alongside any new malls/markets that did decide to use the contract system.

The contract system should certainly, like @Janna55 puts it, hold both sides accountable and protected from each other, as much as possible. And on that point…

I think you’re right, it can’t ever be fully stopped, but a contract system would definitely be helpful in curbing a few things and making certain areas less “dead” (in some sense of the word), I believe.

And it should be possible to implement a new system to handle these things; as a reminder to everyone reading this thread, it is not really up to us, as players, to figure out the technical details of how such a system would work. We should definitely discuss the nuances of a potential system however.

Heck, as a reminder for everyone, please see this post on how the responsibility of technical detail does not fall on us:


On the point of discussing the nuances of a potential, new, system:

I don’t know what I personally would feel is a good time. Maybe two to three months sounds ok to me, based on my own experience of wanting to take breaks or having real-life interruptions and the like.

I do know I’d want the system to protect my actual assets from the mall/market owner at all times and vice versa, for the sake of being fair to everyone; if the contract expired, the items should simply somehow be returned to the renter/shop owner.