Testing 224 - Farming Earthyams and Bulb return ratio from harvest

[redlegdaddy]

With the current systwm you will have to gather 360 seeds, plant them optimally then wait 6 hours for harvest xD

[Mayumichi]

This comes back to the fact that keeping a steady supply of basic resources for shopkeepers is a real pain, actually impossible if you’re not one of the most known shops. So shopkeepers currently have to rely on farming most of the things themselves.

[Xaldafax]

@redlegdaddy

Farming should be something you do to avoid having to run around and surface gather for hours not in addition to running around for hours.

Yes but expecting a 100% return and never doing that step again is unrealistic and not for the best interest of the game. People need to understand that and put the games interest ahead of their own.

Farming makes plenty of things easier in one way and maybe not easier in another. But this is no different than we meteors showed and normal hunting went away. People have to accept the game is changing and take the time to influence the developers in a way they can understand… not just pointing out the same thing over and over without proof or data to show how it should change or even give other ideas on what else to change to balance it…

[redlegdaddy]

Plenty of proof and data in the thread. 67% MAX return means new seeds needed after EVERY harvest. This effectively replaces aoe block farming for these mats with surface gathering (yes again) with time gating.

[Xaldafax]

@NerArth

By all means though, I do want someone to gather a couple of thousand seeds on testing and report how long they actually took to do it, and with what run-speed etc.

We need to do this so we can make sure a decent amount of seeds can be gathered to support a farm. The issue is certainly two fold - gathering and seed retention percentage after multiple crops VS the current production go out and gather time frame in a true sense VS the current production go out and gather time frame with regen bombs.

[anon42939288]

@Xaldafax

we need to step back and see the game from a bigger perspective. Farming is a new way and provides more content and engagement

the tick is tho right now that is hard with the fact that we are purposely given “testing” times with the test build and not what they will be like with live we have no idea if this update is going to do more harm then good if even the most basic corp takes 3HR’s to harvest then thats just more one “log off and play something else” the farming version of crafting

[Smellow]

It seems to me that, maybe a solution would be to make the max rate of seeds 95% yield from crops. This way people dont have to go out and forage for seeds every single time they want to farm. OR make the drop for seeds around 5 for each plant so people dont have to spend as much time harvesting and it’s not terribly hard to get a stockpile of seeds.

[Xaldafax]

@redlegdaddy

Plenty of proof and data in the thread. 67% MAX return means new seeds needed after EVERY harvest. This effectively replaces aoe block farming for these mats with surface gathering (yes again) with time gating.

I’m sorry but how is this helpful? There isn’t enough data or it would have been changed… This is just complaining.

It is responses like this that just make the devs step back and go focus on gathering the data other ways and not post in these forums… I’ve watched this thread get worse and worse and Ross has taken time to try to respond.

You all aren’t helping much in presenting ideas like this.

Show him numbers of normal gathering vs regen versus farming (where you actually gathered seeds). Get the full picture of it… not just focusing on getting the 100% seed return.

[redlegdaddy]

I would be cool with being able to roll some of my crop into seeds. I am “paying” with mats over spending the time to go gather more seeds. This puts the choice with me on how I spend my time. More choice = good.

[Oggieogham]

@rossstephens

all orbs being Removed

This is no where in the patch notes or in the game

So all the current ways orbs currently drop will stay? That’s good to hear, since that was part of my question
My question was about :

@Oggieogham

the current drops of star berries, earthyam, waxy yams, exotic yams, all orbs being Removed!?!?!?

These other earlier comments had made me concerned:

@MinerDiggerMan

I got a question since I’m confused.

Which foods don’t drop anymore? Like, when I start the game, I break leaves to get starberries, and I dig soil to get earth yams.

Has that changed?

@morey523

Yes that will change. You can only get starberries from the vines and yams from the yam plants

@Ratchel

I’m just hearing Regen farms will be getting pushed out of the game basically. There is no need to remove these drops from blocks. Let people farm the way they want. If want to use Regen farms let them. If they want to grow them let them. Don’t rip someone’s work away from them. Don’t tell someone how they should play the game, let them play the way that makes the game enjoyable to them.

[Xaldafax]

@anon42939288

the tick is tho right now that is hard with the fact that we are purposely given “testing” times with the test build and not what they will be like with live we have no idea if this update is going to do more harm then good

Yes but data needs to be really valuable or they will go with their first assessment and then balance later in production. And even if people get the numbers they want now it could be balanced back in production.

With so many responses it just seems people don’t get the developers perspective and why these decisions were put in place. Work with the design they gave and make it better across ALL aspects of the game… not just focus on one thing.

Harm/Good is a relative and contextual thing… The devs feel the system is good… I kind of agree right now. We don’t have the data to prove it wrong based not the game.

[Fallon]

Shopkeepers can/should allocate products by raising prices, if they’re having trouble keeping stock.

[Smellow]

Another solution being talked about is the ability to have some kind of machine that takes the produce and turns it into seeds. So maybe there could be a machine that takes in single, bulk, and mass craft of a harvested plant and produces seeds accordingly.

EX)
1 yam = 1 yam seed
18 yam = 25 yam seeds
36 yams = 50 yam seeds

And then just have the plants not drop seeds ?

[Phalaropus]

Whether or not the time it takes to gather seeds and resources is balanced, the point is, I, personally, not sure about anyone else, would like some way to make a sustainable farm where I don’t have to keep going into the wild to get more seeds.

100% seed drops isn’t the only solution; In fact, a good way to balance gathering and farming would be to keep the drop rate below 100%, and then let actual earthyams/bulbs be converted into seeds themselves.

I agree we need more data before we make a final decision, but we also need to have a goal in mind: and for me, that’s sustainable farming.

[Xaldafax]

@Fallon

Shopkeepers can/should allocate products by raising prices, if they’re having trouble keeping stock.

Try to not make 100-200% margin and go with 15%… or whatever the current margins are… I know in some areas they seem huge.

[Xaldafax]

@Smellow

Another solution being talked about is the ability to have some kind of machine that takes the produce and turns it into seeds. So maybe there could be a machine that takes in single, bulk, and mass craft of a harvested plant and produces seeds accordingly.

EX)
1 yam = 1 yam seed
18 yam = 25 yam seeds
36 yams = 50 yam seeds

And then just have the plants not drop seeds ?

Immensely good constructive idea - more content and assets and things to do. I always feel things like this help balance the direction the devs want the game to go while still giving back to the community.

@James @rossstephens. … would you all be open to ideas like this to help balance natural seeds vs kind of manufactured seeds?

[Xaldafax]

@Phalaropus

I agree we need more data before we make a final decision, but we also need to have a goal in mind: and for me, that’s sustainable farming.

If they want some form of work and not 100% could you be expected to maybe replenish the water or do some other types of things to keep that farm going? Like where people need to keep land fallow for some time to replenish the nutrients?

[Kal-El]

@Smellow

Another solution being talked about is the ability to have some kind of machine that takes the produce and turns it into seeds. So maybe there could be a machine that takes in single, bulk, and mass craft of a harvested plant and produces seeds accordingly.

EX)
1 yam = 1 yam seed
18 yam = 25 yam seeds
36 yams = 50 yam seeds

And then just have the plants not drop seeds ?

I like the idea but not sure about what good ratios might be. If I plant 25 yams then I get 7 to use in order to replant or if I plant 50 then I get only 14 to sell in order to get enough seeds to replant the same field. I am not sure the return is enough to justify farming. It might have to be significantly higher.

[redlegdaddy]

This puts the choice to the player, sacrifice some produce or go gather some seeds. More choice is good, more player agency is good.

[Phalaropus]

Yeah, that also makes total sense.
That seems like a fair compromise.