Which kind of soulbinding do we want?

Hey there …

I just asked myself which kind of binding items to the player we would prefer. I know two different concepts on this:

  • The simple binding of every equipment when you use it. This is the system the most MMOs use (WoW for example). So when you craft something, you can use it OR give/sell it to other people. If you put it on it is instandly bound to that character (soulbound) and you can only put it into your inventory or containers. Nobody else can pick it up or use it. This way of binding is quite easy and familar for the most people, but it limits the use of Items you only use for a short time. Of cause there can be little differences between the handling of different power levels of items. So you could let “non magical” items unbound, but let all “better” items be bound on use (In WoW for example some items were bound on pickup or “only” bound to your account, not the single character).

  • The manual binding with a bonus for doing it. This is the method Guild Wars 1 used for it’s weapons. The concept is also quite simple. An Item is “open” to use or take it for everyone but you CAN bind it to your character (with the same limitations then in the first example). If you bind it to you, the item gets a bonus (for example: in GW the bound weapons got 20% extra damage). On this way the Items may get a bit more “movement” between players, but if you want to get a bonus (that may come in very different ways) you have to bind it (and so take it out of the trade volume).

I like the way Guild Wars handled the binding, but that’s only my opinion. What do you think?

I do like the sound of that “guild wars” binding system.
I struggle with any sort of binding system however, because What if you kill a player and their equipment is bound? does that player lose any items, can you use any of the items dropped if a player can lose items?! It has a lot of implications to add item binding to a Sandbox Survival game, which typically have a very open item economy.

Rather not see stuff being bound however I would like to see the crafter of an item

So someone is highly skilled in making swords or armour if he made the item his name will be on it as creator no matter who uses it

Also something like quality if someone is well skilled in crafting he/she could make better quality items then someone who just started

Maybe good crafters equipment could have better stats durability special effects resource cost reduction all possible options to show for crafting a lot

So all in all no soul binding plox just the name on stuff about who crafted it

On the topic of pvp looting Ben said, that they are thinking about that you do not lose what you have equipped on death, also no tokens or currency. However, mats may be lost for good :wink:

With the quality of crafted items is a total different topic. I agree with you that a skilled crafter should be able to make better stuff and that every item should show who made it (at least equipment and rare furniture). But no binding at all may also be an option of cause :wink:

I think it should be Bound On Use. meaning when i use a sword i have a soul meter, which is empty, as i use the sword it goes up and when it is maxed the item is soulbound to the character and it gets a small boost in stats, the soul status stays for you even when unequipped so you cannot just unequip and equip to avoid the soulbind.

Making higher tier require less kills before it is bound would also be optimal. so 50 kills for a common item, 30 for an uncommon, 20 for rare, 10 for epic, and 5 for legendary, or something like that

so basically a mix where you can use the item but at one point it will be bound to you. an argument could be ‘‘then you could just keep making and using swords’’ well. yeah. but this is a way to make it something to think about while not making it too intrusive and not making it too OP like ‘‘i used this legendary master sword of doom for 2 months and i will now sell it’’ in this way he could equip it and try it a bit before deciding, this would also be amazing for things like RP gear, so he could walk around with it and not get it bound if he just doesnt kill anything.

Personally I think if equipment drops are going to be an important part of Oort then I definitely think soul binding should be implemented. As player at face value it seems more convenient for it to not be the case, but for long term enjoyment of the game you want to have something to strive for. Soul binding on use helps keep the game from getting flooded with the best items too quickly. However, if soul binding is used I sure do hope you don’t lose your equipment on death. That would be a bit too harsh for my tastes lol

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you keep all of your equipped items and everything in your pouch (gems, tokens and oortshards) but drop the materials you have on yourself.

No binding for me. I always hated that. I see no reason to implement it and if you want to regulate the number of rare items adjuste the droprate/recipes.

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you could still loose unequiped soulbound items.

Well when you write with a pencil does it magnetically glue itself to you? I think not so I’ll go with the second option.

In Lineage II there was no soulbinding. Therefore the crafting was very expensive and farm intensive.
That meant, that you could craft a weapon, test a char with that weapon and if you didnt like it, you could sell it for a fair price.

Lineage II used another system. You could add a soul crystal to your Items. That means you had to farm a stone and level this stone by doing raid bosses. And then you could get a bonus on your weapon and armor. Example: 15% casting speed. The item was still tradeable. That was very good for the market. Then you could farm Lifestones and with that Lifestones you could argument your item. A argumented item could have a extra skill (which doesnt rely to your class), like a healer got a DPS skill on his weapon. If you argumented a item, you couldnt trade it. Those argumented items were very necessary on high level which means, that a big amount of ingame currency was spent for those arguments. Example: A mob gave you 1.000 ingame currency. And for a good arguement you needed about 100-300kk (yes kk). That means, if you hunt for a arguement and it was expensive you would never sell this weapon again. Also it takes a huge amount of ingame currency out of the game.

why would i ever not use a rare drop i get then? its to add choice and consequence, i do know you want 0 consequences in the game and be able to use everything everywhere anytime which is fine. but if you can get a legendary item, you should need to think whether you want it or you should sell it. not both.

hopefully you mean augment not argument, but that sounds like a really grind intensive system.

Ah ■■■■ yes, its augment. Yes Lineage II was a very hard grinder. It was one of the first MMOs who came out, but it wasnt very popular in EU. Thats why I don’t know what you mean by “Legendary Item”. When I remember Lineage II, it was about ~1 years for the “best gear” if you hitted maxlevel.

But let me take a example. You play a archer. There are 2 bows ingame. A crossbow and a longbow for example.
You get a “Legendary Longbow”, but you prefer the crossbow which 90% of the other players do too because its stronger (for example). Thats why the “Legendary Longbow” is cheaper than the “Legendary Crossbow”. Does it really make sense, that I have to sell the Longbow instantly instead equip it till I get a better Crossbow and sell it then?

Most mmo’s tends to be rather balanced in that sense, but look at it from the other point, you dont face any consequence for using it by your system, that is the problem because the economy and items (as you said) would be insanely high and based on grinding, if i got to a raidboss and i get a master sword i can use that sword, but only me, it is bound to me, which means that even if i want to give it away i cannot, and the only way the sword will get into trade is by getting a new drop,

imagine it as a huge wheel that turns around, you get the master sword added everytime somebody gets the drop and the wheel goes around, when somebody it equips it that item leaves the wheel. that way you can keep the legendary weapon wheel running although limited.


now your idea is that whenever you craft a legendary item it goes into the wheel, but it never leaves, ever, so there is only things going out and nothing leaving, by time there will be too many and it is no longer legendary items cause too many can get them, you cannot balance that because nobody leaves the wheel. the only thing they can do is minimize the rate of how many items drop to near 0, so as you said, it would require a years worth of grind, but that is not enjoyable for anyone.

i think rarer items should be rare and take materials to make them rare, but they shouldnt be unobtainable for those who dont have the time to game for a year, they might not be able to get it fast and it should not be easy, but if you make a rare boss able to drop items but they only drop that one item every thousand times it is killed and maybe take 1 hour for a really good team to kill. nobody is ever going to bother.

common item are easy to make so it doesnt matter if they circle around, but if you keep adding rare items then they will not be rare in that sense later on.

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Your system relys on the fact that a “Legendary Weapon” is the best weapon ingame, is that true?
So there is no system for enhancement? Like, you craft a Legendary Hammer which has about 200 Damage.
Then you can farm “enhance weapon scrolls” and you have a xyz% chance to increase the stats of the hammer or it fails and your hammer is gone and you get crafting materials out. Like lets say until +3 (250 Damage) its safe, afterwards it can fail. Then lets stay +10 is max then you have a “Legendary Hammer +20” which does 600 Damage. Because then you take out like 99% of the legendary weapons just because you can make them finite stronger. I am not very common with those casual mmos. I take the word casual because you spoke about time. The problem of Guild Wars and similiar MMOs is, that if you have your max gear after a time of xyz hours you have nothing else to get it better. And thats what I don’t like. There are 2 types of players. Dedicated players: they play 1 char, level him up, gear it up. Casual/Dedicated Clan/Guild Players: They play like all chars, gear slower, level slower. The system which you are talking about is for the 2nd type of players. The first type of players will lose the interest in the game afterwards with your system.

if you ever watched SAO you are familliar with this, your system will massively reduce the amount of legendaries which can drop, but allowing it to be bound allows more to get into the game without making them common and useless.

i imagine you will be able to refine and enchant weapons also legendaries, yeah, its a good argument as long as there is a limit, i can see your argument that you should be able to use it and i have the opposite argument that it removes the choice of hwether or not you should use it or sell it. but you have some damn good arguments, you just seem used to korean games which are based on grinding, i dont want to grind 4 months to get a legendary item, i would like to have an insanely hard fight with a titan.or get some really challenging to obtain mats

so instead of very easy over very long time
i would like very hard over very short time

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Wouldn’t that result in the same?

I thought again about the whole thing and I can live with binding things to a char as long as there is a way so I can give a friend a weapon I previously used. Like a Scroll you don’t get easily. And as long as I can recycle bound weapons.

Allowing the recycle of bound weapons removes the whole point of bounding the weapon

and is it the same?

  1. use 5 hours every day for 3 months because you need 15 000 hides from a common animal
  2. Fight a boss monster that requires serious efford where every second counts and only the best and most skilled fighters can kill it. if you win you have a chance to get the legendary item

you tell me. are they the same?

No because if you recycle it (obviously you don’t get all the mats back) then you have no longer a high-lvl weapon/armor in the game and you can’t most likely craft it again if you are a fighter (assuming you can not learn everything within a few years).

they are the same if you include the time you use to get as good as you have to be to beat that single boss monster.