CANCELED: Forging Changes

Whoo! Nothing sets my adhd off like shiny lights and fun noises.

3 Likes

In general, the Quirk and Defects in game should be less punishing than they are now. In fact, none of them should effectively make a forged item less useful than its preforged base. This may be an RNG, but you are still putting resources into it and the outcome should reflect that.

Quirks, as they are right now, are really more like defects and have way too many downsides. I feel that quirks should instead make the forged item more situationally effective or have some sort of trade off.
A quirk like Unbalanced (or maybe Unwieldy), for example, should dish out slightly more damage but be a bit slower and cost more energy.
A quirk like Top Layer (or Edaphologic) may make a shovel more effective at dealing with soil and mud but less effective with sand, gravel, and ash.

Defects should be less punishing and never counteract a boon (a damage boon should remove the possibility that a damage defect comes up for example) but the same should be true for boons (a speed defect should remove the possibility of a speed boon). Plus many existing quirks are bad enough to be defects (like that random activation thingā€¦ better yetā€¦ lets just not have that oneā€¦).

All in all, what this does is make it so an item with quirks an defects are usable and not just trash you dumped resources into. Forged items without quirks and defects will still be sought after, but its less of a big deal if an item has them. Heck, certain quirks could be sought after for certain tasks, which would be really interesting.

8 Likes

Ah, I see. I only mentioned the 1x3 because it is unique i think in that you do 60% dmg, while all other aoe do 40% dmg. that makes less ā€œdamageā€ boon needed to bring it in line.

Please remove the top tier of the AoE boon. It is useless. Thanks.

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I loved those slot machines, what was it ā€œSSSUUURRRPPPRRRIIISSSEEEā€ then BOOM

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Your exagerating the rng, its not at all as unwieldly as you make it out to be. And that rng dont bellng in crafting is purely your personal opinion, yet you prjoject it as if it was some profound truthā€¦

Well, few companies have tanked their game as heavily as blizzard. I mean the game is so dumbed down compared to vanilla that all theyve tried the lasr 2-3 years is to fix the game.
The whole blizzzard board have been replaced a couple of times and the originality and autencity of the company is gone, and they will never rise again. Haha theyve even started to focus on mobile gamesā€¦
Moneymoneymoneyā€¦
Not a company inwant wonderstruck to take any inspiration from.

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Theyā€™re trying to make it harder. At least adding boons is better than forcing broken quirks onto players

That doesnā€™t make it harder. Just makes it cost more resource.

To a certain extent. The point of the forge is to be a bit unpredictable and maybe not get exactly the item you wanted. Thatā€™s what they want the forge to be like, they donā€™t want you to be able to get these amazing items every time really easily. Iā€™m just saying Iā€™d rather they change this by adding more boons so you might not get exactly what you wanted but itā€™s probably still a usable tool instead of forcing players to have quirks that ruin the tool.

3 Likes

See my question is if you cant make high end tools without quirks and defects that break them whatā€™s the point? The point of end game is to have all that stuff. To make the grind that youā€™ve suffered hours through already be worth it. As someone who started this game a week after release and has played it basically solo the entire time except for community hunts this is crippling. Iā€™m builder, crafter, hunter, gatherer and shop owner. Itā€™s hard enough to do everything I do alone without you adding more hours of needless grind to the mix. I was really enjoying forging and this game, but this is extreme. You cant take out the only real way to make high end forged gear without quirks and defects. They cost enough time and rare ingredients to make as is since you have to go get it all somehow. Then the rng can always decide to not give you what you want which happens to me frequently regardless of using the gum and boon removal solvent. Which I might add sometimes just adds another boon on top to where you cant get rid of the previous one you originally trying to. And for something that has such a high item cost already should absolutely get rid of the body unwanted boon without messing you up farther. Regardless forging still doesnt always work out. I personally think the way it works now is fine as far as the draining compound. Address the accessibility for lower level players absolutely. But dont obliterate the only way to make the best gear. Unless you have another option to make them without quirks and defects that doesnt desire even more rare ā– ā– ā– ā–  that frankly Iā€™ll give up on.

This is exactly why Iā€™d love to see the changes proposed come to testing. Iā€™ve said before, i think quirks need a rework. And it needs to be run through thoroughly in testing before betting considered for live at all

Now consider the scopeā€¦

World of Warcraft had literally millions of people playing at one time (different servers). WoW has made over $10 BILLION since 2004. When a company gets that big, the vision and scope inevitably changes. Not to mention, the game has been out for 14 years (as of Nov 23rd).

You really dont want Wonderstruck to be inspired by the most successful online game of all time?

Sure forging needs to be balanced some. However I do believe the draining compound and vigour catalyst is in the right place. (Considering ingredient cost and power needed to make them).
I rather would like to see some buffs to gums and the boon removal solvent(it gives the same removed buff back frequently).

Please consider the time needed to forge a item and how long it can be used for.

Also this game is in its post release phase, changes like this makes it feel like a beta.
If pushed this will impact the current established market much.

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RNG should not be removed or dumbed down from forging. I find it quite exciting to see what will happen with each forging round. Also, I donā€™t want these ā€˜Master Forgersā€™ to be able to churn out perfect AOE hammers all the time. If you change the system to rely on increased mats for the top forges then you are going to create an elite who will just pull away from everyone else. Once they make and sell their perfect hammers they start rolling in cash and it becomes easy to buy the ingredients they need. No thanks, keep the random element in forging.

I am considering scope. You really want to use crappy quirk and defect ridden weapons while we wait for 2 years for dark matter etc?

Exactly. Everything should be tested and thoroughly thought out before anything drastic like that. I feel the compound and catalyst are in a good place personally. The rng in my opinion prevents people from getting exactly what they are after everytime. The ingredients are already cost heavy or time heavy either way. I just feel there is a better way without attacking specific ingredients. I really liked an idea earlier on this post about just adding more boons. Just different things you could do. Theres usually always a preferable boon set but if itā€™s less likely youā€™ll get it but still get something worth your effort that sounds fair. However giving me a quirk or defect that can cause me to die by stupid things and make the weapon useless and my time wasted does not. Besides it would add more variety. The answer isnt always to nerf things but to add different options. They keep taking things away eventually you have nothing left lol.

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So my solution is this: First of all look at the player count now and 2 months ago, and a reaction of players on last 4 patches (minus the 205). I think that You guys should wait for like 2 months or so, and look at whats happening, let things settle, and then do the needed changes, instead of juggling meta back and forth every 2 weeks because something is op. To me there needs to be both trash and op stuff in the game, wooden tools should be trash, so that you feel the difference. Forging should make a noticeable difference, like it does now. The main hard part for forging is gathering items, not actually forgingā€¦ make items easier to gather then or somethingā€¦ especially hunted items, now that the player base is so low.

Also a suggestion on how to check if an update is any good: get yourself a 30-40 level character with unforged tools and clear inventory , and then try getting the resources for forging ingredients, crafting the ingredients, and then try not to get screwed over with the an INSANE randomness of actually forging. And then you can get an idea if all this was worth the forged item you ended up with.(And thats not considering the gems and other materials you lose if you fail to forge a tool)

I just tried it on the test server with several alternative ideas of rotations, 8 failed gem hammers is the result, with zero successes, maybe im stupid, but i think that if you make changes like that, then you must have more options to reduce the randomness.

I guess there is no refund after playing for 280 hours (in just 2.5 months) :D. It was an amazing game when i began playing (just 2.5 months ago!), now im about to make like 5 alts stash my stuff into them and wait for some update that is not a nerf of what works for people :smiley: I love the game, but now this is becoming sad even to me.

P.S. Sry about my English =( And i hope that this is constructive enough

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My biggest gripe with forging at the moment is this. There are no ā€œrotationsā€.

There isnt one way where you juggle defect points to boost boon points (as seems to be intended), the other where you go straight pure boon is do-able but will always end short of anything more than a mid-high 1boon tool, or one where you take on quirks to soften the hit from defectsā€¦

If you study the compounds these seem like broad categories that were aimed for. We wont know, because the draining compound and vigour catalyst is so much better than any of these that it is practically the only way worth doing it. Ideally resource scarcity should hint people to try the other rotations, but the imbalance is in the godlike, clean boon results from only one set of steps. Anything else is far inferior and i want more options

If itā€™s a random process and defects ruin items then that just drives the cost up.

The core problem here and why this got rolled back is that forging is broken. People spent time on the system and discovered how to bypass most of the downsides. What was proposed in this thread is just a stop gap. They realized there are bigger problems with foeing.

The real solution is to gut forging and deploy a new version of it. A more robust one.

1 Like