CANCELED: Forging Changes

forge
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#291

Exactly. Everything should be tested and thoroughly thought out before anything drastic like that. I feel the compound and catalyst are in a good place personally. The rng in my opinion prevents people from getting exactly what they are after everytime. The ingredients are already cost heavy or time heavy either way. I just feel there is a better way without attacking specific ingredients. I really liked an idea earlier on this post about just adding more boons. Just different things you could do. Theres usually always a preferable boon set but if it’s less likely you’ll get it but still get something worth your effort that sounds fair. However giving me a quirk or defect that can cause me to die by stupid things and make the weapon useless and my time wasted does not. Besides it would add more variety. The answer isnt always to nerf things but to add different options. They keep taking things away eventually you have nothing left lol.


#292

So my solution is this: First of all look at the player count now and 2 months ago, and a reaction of players on last 4 patches (minus the 205). I think that You guys should wait for like 2 months or so, and look at whats happening, let things settle, and then do the needed changes, instead of juggling meta back and forth every 2 weeks because something is op. To me there needs to be both trash and op stuff in the game, wooden tools should be trash, so that you feel the difference. Forging should make a noticeable difference, like it does now. The main hard part for forging is gathering items, not actually forging… make items easier to gather then or something… especially hunted items, now that the player base is so low.

Also a suggestion on how to check if an update is any good: get yourself a 30-40 level character with unforged tools and clear inventory , and then try getting the resources for forging ingredients, crafting the ingredients, and then try not to get screwed over with the an INSANE randomness of actually forging. And then you can get an idea if all this was worth the forged item you ended up with.(And thats not considering the gems and other materials you lose if you fail to forge a tool)

I just tried it on the test server with several alternative ideas of rotations, 8 failed gem hammers is the result, with zero successes, maybe im stupid, but i think that if you make changes like that, then you must have more options to reduce the randomness.

I guess there is no refund after playing for 280 hours (in just 2.5 months) :D. It was an amazing game when i began playing (just 2.5 months ago!), now im about to make like 5 alts stash my stuff into them and wait for some update that is not a nerf of what works for people :smiley: I love the game, but now this is becoming sad even to me.

P.S. Sry about my English =( And i hope that this is constructive enough


#293

My biggest gripe with forging at the moment is this. There are no “rotations”.

There isnt one way where you juggle defect points to boost boon points (as seems to be intended), the other where you go straight pure boon is do-able but will always end short of anything more than a mid-high 1boon tool, or one where you take on quirks to soften the hit from defects…

If you study the compounds these seem like broad categories that were aimed for. We wont know, because the draining compound and vigour catalyst is so much better than any of these that it is practically the only way worth doing it. Ideally resource scarcity should hint people to try the other rotations, but the imbalance is in the godlike, clean boon results from only one set of steps. Anything else is far inferior and i want more options


#295

If it’s a random process and defects ruin items then that just drives the cost up.

The core problem here and why this got rolled back is that forging is broken. People spent time on the system and discovered how to bypass most of the downsides. What was proposed in this thread is just a stop gap. They realized there are bigger problems with foeing.

The real solution is to gut forging and deploy a new version of it. A more robust one.


#296

I’m not really that cut up about it you know, it was said more in a jovial way.
Maybe I should edit in a “chill, it wasn’t for resell and I don’t even own a shop”
Might cut off any more smug posts that think an evil merchant just got owned :slight_smile:


#297

(post withdrawn by author, will be automatically deleted in 24 hours unless flagged)


#298

Sure thing


#299

This. Just listen to the players and make a fun game. Nobody wants to play Soviet Union Similator.


#300

Or if they don’t think forging costs are high enough just add wax to everything.


#301

WoW lived off its peak. Its not such a success story as you and most blizzard pressreleases make it out to be. If the game was such a sucess they wouldnt have fired so many ceo’s and changed the entire board so many times or get bought and thrown into complex company merges.

It did make money yes, but becouse the game were great, they did ruin it step by step, and wow had had some pretty steeep dropps in population you dont here much about.

And dont use how much money a game has made, especially when you just talk about income and sales and not profit!

I mean the most profitable/sold/eaten food in my country is frozen pizza.
It doesnt make frozen pizza the best food around though…


#302

God, i’m not excited at all for farming. I just hope it isn’t absolutely terrible.


#303

Or use pure compound and transmutation. There other ingredients out there.

This is a bad idea, have you tried forging a slingbow? There are so many boons is so hard to get what you want. I rather have the right boons and 1-2 quirks than a tool without the boons I need specially at max forging quirks wouldn’t make much of a difference.


#304

I’m not saying Blizzard is the best ever, or to mimic Blizzard or anything.

But to completely dismiss the game and company is foolish from a business standpoint. You have to see what worked for them and what didnt and try not to mimic their failures and try to utilize their successes and see how those successes relate to your business and product/s.

But to completely dismiss them? That seems silly to me strictly from a business perspective.


#305

Ive never said to dismiss them, i actually said that wonderstuck should learn from their mistakes instead of doing the same as them.

Blizzard made an good game (vanilla) but it wasnt as much the product as it was the timing and the fact that the mmo market was ready.

The market is alot harder now then it was back then.

An good product, luck, weak competition and a market that was ready and hungering for that product is the story behind the success.

After the first 1-3 years its all downhill due to bad decisonmaking. Watering out their product and playing it safe, dumbing down mechanics etc.


#306

I’m just going off what you said… the quote above is literally what prompted me to respond.

Heck, I’m not even disagreeing with what you said. The only difference between us is that I feel they should be inspired, even if the inspiration is to do exactly opposite of what Blizzard did, by WoW and by Blizzard.

Even in your last post you kinda walked back what you said in the above quote. So, our viewpoints might not be different at all. :wink:


#307

LoL i dont think they are. Seems like the only difference is that im bitter at blizzard for ruining a game which meant alot to me st an early age.

Haha, im the same with from software over bloodborne and dks3 vs dks 1 and 2.

Hmm, i hope i aint turned into a bitter naysayibg hipster…

Ill just live life in the belief that my viewpoints are valid. And not based on nostalgia.

Its atleast clear to me that my bitterness clouds my abilty to dechiper others meaning.

Thank you for helping me see we agree, lol.

Im’a take a break now. :v:t2::v:t2:


#308

please do not nerf the forging , its my happiness people have different wants and my hobbies are forging , some are building and some are selling things. If you will nerf the forg you will make us sad and less motivated to play the game :frowning: ive been playing the whole day and night just because i enjoy it so much but if you will take that enjoyment from us every time you change the game you will lose most of the players like me. I hope you will not touch the forging. PLEASE DONT please.


#309

Thank you for canceling this planned update. I recognize your interest in trying to encourage favorable atmospheres for those under 30 hours but by making things less attainable such as a perfect Uber Gem Hammer denies the game its very name. I feel they should be adding to whatever they have in order to fix problems rather than mess with what exists. (A semi-permanent product is why you had to release it, ready or not) I personally try to help the economy by mass forging titanium tools and selling them around 5k to 10k. Thats an easy amount for any player who has experience points into the power skill and luck skill to make in an hour of gathering and selling to request baskets and allows them to mine on gem level worlds. Power wall? increase gem abundance.

I would like to see the game expand. I know its asking for alot, but i would like to see some more unique planets at tiers 3/4 Maybe planets made completely of gravel like mars where one can find an abundance of those spiky plants or an ash blast world with low elevation lava and tons of hoppers. Make it bound less, and along with that stretch out the solar system to make it require more a network and segregate planets from other planets thus causing rarity and desirability and opportunity while boosting rough oortstone drops to assist travel. Let us do more with the time we have.

Like others i have found myself in a cycle of gather forge mine repeat. I recently was able to add building to the mix and an occasional hunt. Id like to see you elaborate on these ideas and maybe segregate them as categories a bit more, maybe with new Epic skills?

I am enjoying the game but i want to be able to take advantage of everything it offers before they nerf something again. I plead that they think twice about limiting anything.

Thank you.


#310

I’m glad to see this rollback. Please for a good time I think we need only “pluses” and no “minuses”, the balance can wait, and give us, players, a little more time to settle up things (Are we “Over Forging”?)
I think we will start seeing more users buying mid-level forged stuff. Who doesn’t want to play a bit with a 400 forged hammer? Surely I’m. But I won’t spend that kind of coins for my every day tasks.


#311

That absolutely do not work as well. And of course I’ve forged slingbows. Exactly it’s already hard to get what you want. I’d rather more positive options than to be forced with quirks and defects. That do inevitably make a difference in the quality of the weapons. Besides I’m not even saying do it this way lol. I’m just giving a suggestion that’s better than what they are thinking.