CANCELED: Forging Changes

forge
Tags: #<Tag:0x00007f4f06dec608>

#169

It would have been nice to see this update on testing but not necessarily release it to live.


#170

I agree on everything you said, almost wish we could vote you into being a community manager!


#171

It’s what…9pm over there on UK timezone. And the devs are still at work? If that isn’t a sign of dedication to the development of the game then I don’t know what is.


#172

You want her to keep playing the game. Not quit it.


#173

And to make her jokes on the forums / discord. :wink:


#174

I haven’t read all the posts in detail but the controversy was only around Draining Boon Compound, right?
Because the other changes around lowering the entry barrier to forgning were pretty good, imho.
I remember that the first time I got useful results from forging was way beyond my first set of advanced coils for all machines.


#175

I’m a little late to the party but here are my thoughts anyways.

This is definitely a step in the right direction, but I don’t think it goes far enough to encourage me to try out forging at a lower level. Definitely would help to remove reactive lamella from the compound base recipe too.

Here’s my issue with low level forging. The benefit has to be worth the time spent forging PLUS the time spent farming the mats for the session. Right now I just don’t see that happening. I can spend a bunch of time farming mats so I can forge a hammer that mines twice as fast…or I could just spend that time mining instead.

I’m pretty sure I come out ahead not bothering with forging. To be honest I’m not completely sure, but that’s part of the problem - it has the appearance of being a high end system whether it actually is or not. Forging requires so many different kinds of materials to get started, it’s really hard to imagine it being worth the time as a low level player. Especially when considering the RNG involved.


#176

I’m really saddened by this. That’s all I can say I guess. A very vocal forum minority control where this game goes. There’s a case to be made that the ‘veterans’ and vocal minority via discord and forums are a reason a large chunk of players are driven off.

I think actually seeing what changes were introduced and how they were introduced on test would have stamped out a lot of concerns or allowed people to see just how bad the impact was and what to do to soften it or to address it.

You probably know better at the end of the day from your update that maybe the entire system just needs an overhaul and that’ll come later down the road maybe? I get it. Just sad about it. People are way too quick to protest without seeing how things actually play out. They could stomach footfall being what it was for so long but no changes to the forge system. It’s mind boggling really.


#177

Friggin, what!?! Noooo!!.. well… gj to some people. congrats. get ready for 100c gems, and shops that sell nothing but forging mats.

You get to keep your OP hammers.

Don’t forget to tell new people what to do when they show up.

“Just get enough coin to buy one of these Hammers, after that, mine gems… rinse repeat.”
“Have fun!”


#178

Not that I wish to denigrate the poster but I dislike that idea a lot. Changing systems to give even less chance of what you’re after will suck. If I’m forging, it’s for a reason. If I’m forging for a reason, the boons I am not after will be unwelcome, no matter if they’re new, good or not.


#179

Yeah, alienate all the brewers and cooks? Nah I like the sound of the proposed changes. If there’s a single, easy way to get full-stat no-drawback tools that nobody anywhere who has any experience in forging is using anything other than those 4 compounds / gums / solvents… then there’s a problem.

Kinda like back in the day when nobody was using hammers to mine, remember?

+1 though for adding and shaking up some quirks. Would love them to be half good half bad (not in the same quirk thugh) so you’d be gambling with those quirk points too instead of just washing them off with a solvent.


#180

you dont find it fun when everybody seems to be mining gems 24/7 to sell them for less and less to get the tools to mine gems 25/7?
but easier is fun isn’t it?
Yeah no I’m with you hehe. we must be weird sorry man. :man_shrugging:


#181

Yeah, adding even more RNG to the system doesn’t exactly sound desirable either. I think whatever ends up happening to the Forging process in the end, I probably won’t be Forging much anymore.


#182

Honestly, I’m not sure things need to be balanced, what we need is more players to consume product. Half the problem is that there is a lot of gems now, but no one to sell too. From the poll on the other forum only 35% of players actually forge, meaning 65% would be buying.

But the population is so low and the money in the system is low, so nothing is moving. If we have more moving product or more players to consume items, then you will see less gems in the system.

Edit: I mean small tweaks yes, small additions, minor nerf or buff, but overall more people would help.

Edit again: Also more gem sinks or item sinks, like deco items or deco blocks that use gem. This could apply to gem, gold, and silver. High value deco items, beds, tables, chairs, curtains, glasses, plates, armor, shields, clothing. – the more sinks, the more movement, the more gathering, the more trading and using. Healthier economy.


#184

The issue is these “veterans” are most of the people that are forging because of how late game it is for the most part right now and while letting earlier levels do it a bit the issue is it’s not feasible to do that without a lot of work as we see with reactive lamella.

Simply tossing it on test servers to try it out will still cause people to get frightened and run to craft a ton of the tools now before it’s pushed on the live servers.

The problem is new metas are forced on the players as we saw with bomb mining being removed as an option and making hammers useful with high end forging and killing that off will only make a new meta instead of fixing other issues and hurt the community.

Balance what needs to be fixed is one thing but killing off the current meta in such a way as adding quicks / defects to high end forges is the opposite what anyone wants for the most part because that’s not how higher level crafting like that works in games since it’s usually more expensive to be more useful.

As a new forum account you may not have the experience the game has gone over the past few months since the official release but there have been some major hiccups and people are getting frustrated with the current “fixes” over what needs to be done in many peoples views.


#185

Yeah I agree with you, slingbows are pretty annoying that forge because they have too many possibilities for boons. I rather have a quirk or two than not have the trait that I want


#186

Forging needs a change but this change was to narrow and hit too hard were it was.

A nerf this big has to come with some major addition to keep the change fresh instead of recessive.

The problem was that with this change we lose something without gaining something and its been to much like that.

Addind a couple of new boons with a greater rebalancing would be the ideal way to go.

My thoughts are:

Draining boon compund adds 100 quirk points
Vigourdrain lasts 4 rounds
New boons
Reduced vigor cost of boon removal solvents to balance out the new boons
New quirks
Nerf the defects just a little 5-20%
Buff boongain on compunds by 50-150 depending on the compund.
A sleight buff to stabilty paste and invigorating paste.

The biggest favour for low lever forgers you can do is ass vigour and stabilty cost to the tooltip of forge materials!!

Make the solvent that removes quirks cost less feathers or give more solvents for the same recepie and buff it.
That way you could still make endgame top tier tools without quirks or defects but the cost and effort required would make it balanced.

This should be tried out though, but doing this and maybe altering the stabilty costs of certain compunds would even the playing field and make alot more stuff competetive.


#187

What does the age of my forum account have to do with anything? I never had a need for a forum account until just recently when I was trying to find out information on shops closing and moving and I had hoped to find some people using the search function.

Forges were never intended to be perfect in the first place. It was rushed towards only after the bomb nerf because people wanted another quick and easy way to gem farm.

They have a broken system and know it and theyre trying to fix it. Meta’s be damned.


#188

Here’s a thought for making forging more appealing to low level players: get rid of setting and deconstruction resins entirely. Just let players set and deconstruct from within the forge interface, without having to expend mats. Having to farm for those is an unnecessary complexity. And I’m pretty sure it’s not going to make anything too OP to not have to farm for that anymore.


#189

Not all potions and pies, just the strength and durability ones. Change them to something else.

Instead of a Strength potion, why not a potion that messes with your visuals or Sounds? Make you seem drunk, or make people squeak when they walk by? Why not potions that turn everything you see heat based, or different colored tints? Why not have potions that you can chuck at enemies to debuff them? Why not Potions you can throw to create hazards for mobs, like Sticky patches that prevent enemies from moving, or creates a wall of fire?

And for food, Foods should only be for regening Energy and Health. So instead of Durability, why not add food that literally heals you when you eat it, instead of healing stamina? Why not have food that, when consumed, makes you walk/run faster? Why not Food that Augments your Stamina or HP, increasing the max?

Also I’m not saying it should be ‘EASY’ to get perfect tools with perfect stats. But @Crete and the Devs were talking about, was removing Perfect tools all together, making it impossible to get them at all. It wouldn’t be a rebalance where before it takes 1 hour to get, and now takes 3 months. It would be never, 0%, zero chance of it happening.

All just so lower tier players could be welcomed into the horribly unbalanced, chaotic mess that is a complicated End Game feature brought down to the low tier players to try and give them a new toy, while punishing the end game players, and the dedicated people working, farming, and playing this game for many hours, days, weeks, months, and even years in some cases.

All in the name of Change.


I wonder if you even play the game, with this comment. Or if you even read some of the complaints people had. Heck when I, ME, was complaining about the Gem wall, what did people tell me? “Go Here. Use a 3x3 Hammer.”

And what will happen when they ■■■■ with Forging items? How will people get past the Gem Wall? “Go Here. Use a Hammer.”

Wow Crete, that is such a massive change. But of course, you’re focusing on the wrong part.

It’s not about ‘Buy hammer to Mine Gems’, it’s about ‘Ok, I have a thousand of each Gem. NOW WHAT?’. Cause right now, the answer is ‘Forging’. If this change went through, the answer would be ‘Nothing, either keep collecting Gems or Find a better game.’

If it’s not broke, don’t fix it. Especially in such a way that will break the end game, just so the beginners get something that end game players play with early.