Testing 230: World Shop Scanners!


#121

You are right, I did forget about the other aspects.

Yes, on the breakdown, which wasn’t thinking of, that does make the 40c and even 100c a unfair price. What it would be would depend on if the player is growing their own oats, wheat, has easy access to trees for the charcoal, and shimmering orbs are not easy to get. Unless you go back to paying for the tools needed, the brews and regen bombs to go to a farm where you will be safe.

I prefer to run all over planets getting my orbs, but I also gather other stuff in the process, reactive lamella, kills critters for the blood and if lucky get the ones who drop cores, horns and other trophies on level 6 planets. I get the other items from them for the forging I do for personal usage. Knuts I can collect to make bark, spicy beans, sweet and bitter beans also. Not large amounts, but every little bit helps.

I’ll leave it to others to decide what a fair price would be. That is something I should not have forgotten about, so apologizes to those who feel they are going to be cheated, and they will, by those who drop the prices that low and my forgetting what else goes into making these pies.

I wonder how long they will be able to keep it up, because they will end up with a loss after a while. I don’t see how they can continue to make the pies at the cost of what is needed, even if they gather it all, ,after a while it will get too expensive and time consuming to grow the wheat, oats, go and gather the orbs and gravel, which will be easy to get but that still takes time and more time in collecting the water. Chopping down trees to burn so they can get the charcoal. That can be a lot of work if you have lots of customers who want the pies at 40c. Are they going to have the time?


#122

The idea of free exo yams, oats and wheat sounds nice. But once you sell hundred or more of them a day you will spend all day farming, gathering the other mats AND making the pies…

No one will do that for long…


#123

Before the regen farm nerf and the introduction of farming, pies were already being sold for around 350c. A lot of people were upset the prices had dropped from the 600-700 they had sold. As more people made them, they dropped in price. As more people started farming mud, they dropped in price.

There will always be market adjustments for commodities. The people that used to sell for the higher prices quit making them and started buying them from those who sold for 350. Instead of making pies they started doing something else they enjoy in the game. That’s anecdotal because once upon a time I used to sell persist pies for 750c a piece.


#124

I’m one of the few lucky ones that has a guild that has been growing the wheat, oats, yams and berries for me. So I have lucked out in it. But, the majority of the pies I make for the guild, not to sell. I give some to a friend who collects things I can’t get on exo planets.

So the only things I have to gather is the orbs, gravel, rock salt and make charcoal. Plus turn the wheat into flour, oats in to the milk then the completely frustrating time consuming task of oats into milk, milk into purified milk, into fortified milk, into fortified butter then make the pies.

But, I am one of the lucky few, so those who do have to grow their own wheat and oats have a lot of work for themselves, planting, harvesting for the wheat and then having to grow the seed separate and then planting again knowing that they will have to replant again later so they can keep growing enough wheat and wheat seeds to have what is needed for the flour and then the same with the oats. So, it is no easy task for those who grown their own supplies. I don’t know if it would be cheaper to buy the flour from those who do grow it to sell or not, someone would have to work out the cost ratio. Same with the milk, would it be cheaper to grow the oats or to kill the higher level goats to get the milk glands.

And it looks like this thread has been hijacked, unintentionally, into the very hard task of making a highly desired food item. Which is a good thing to let others know it isn’t as easy as it looks to make persisting pies.

And something that I should not have forgotten, and did, so again apologize to those who make them and will have to deal with the ones who are selling them way too cheap.


#125

I started selling them for 2k+ when I started, lol

But it has to be fun to do, and like I said earlier, have done it so many times now that the amount of time spend on it becomes meh, very meh, to me and if it’s also not giving me much coin in return, well…


#126

Think we sell persisting pies at 199c cuz we are over ridden with exotic yams and bulbs. @Ratchel would know if that’s the right price still


#127

Farming exotics and selling the bulbs was fun till stuck with over a ss of bulbs. Haven’t planted them in a few weeks now lol


#128

The concern about “trolling” with low prices. If somebody is selling pies for 40c, I don’t think their stock is going to last for them to be on the top of the list for long. There will be flippers too, and since the price lists are updated pretty much live, there won’t be old listings there so it’s fairly safe to try to grab a really cheap item.


#129

I was just playing devil’s advocate…

To get people to an area, to troll, or just for ff, someone with 1000 pies could put one or two out a day on a stand for 5c to continually be on the top 16 list. They won’t sell out because they’ll keep putting just one or two out each day.


#130

That’s a full time job then :smiley: Depending on how actively people might be camping a store like that. We’ll see if we have enough players playing the flipping game, or just want cheap items at any cost.


#131

We have some fairly persistent players lol

I mentioned earlier that a list of 16 might be long enough to exceed those few players that are willing to do that.

Still wish quantity info would be on the GUI too. Maybe in the future :woman_shrugging: Apparently I am blind - quantity is included. Derp I did.


#132

I’m very interested in seeing if stuff like that is really profitable :smiley: There have been attempts to manipulate some markets that way in some games and they’ve always failed.

I’d like paging to be possible too. Quantity is there, isn’t it?

If it’s just 16 and no ability to go to the next page I’m worried there will be someone listing the pies for example 40.0, 40.1, 40.2, 40.3, 40.4… and fill the whole page.


#133

Yeah, I think it’s a great start - with the current population. If the game has a growth spurt I think they’ll have to rework it a bit. But that’s to be expected I suppose :+1:
& You’re right, the quantity is listed. I have selective sight :eyes: apparently lol.


#134

Sounds like something that may need to be addressed. Even the requirement to have separate beacons won’t completely solve the issue.
Since Luca has already said they will ban people for inaccessible shop stands, I believe this type of behaviour will be frowned upon at the very least. Maybe they should look at only showing 1 stand per player per planet rather than per beacon.

But… maybe we should wait and see what happens once it rolls out rather than worrying about hypotheticals :rofl:
This doesn’t seem like it would be an incredibly difficult fix to roll out if listing spam does become a problem.


#135

You’re right, quantity is there.
Shop #14 was the highest, with the raw diamonds priced at 1414c each (therefore, not shown).

shop14high


#136

This is a great little QoL update that will make a lot of people very :slightly_smiling_face:. I just tried it and it works perfectly :+1:

  1. Full builder mode with the beacon map
  2. Original builder mode without beacon map
  3. All off

#137

Give it time to see what happens and then go from there…hopefully more great updates to continue moving forward


#138

I will go to guys I know are playing the game and I will continue great friendships and buy from them regardless if been ripped off or not…I am looking forward for the update but I have certain shops I want to support regardless if they are cheapest or not…so a little exploring to a shop beacon because ur too tight wont hurt u.lol


#139

That’s because they eat those…

… persisting pies! :joy:


#140

This is 100% important IMO. People toss around terms like ‘ripped off’ or ‘crooked sellers’ but I see things as being different from what I think @Evergreen is trying to say when he used the phrase “min/max their coins”.

Most players are trying to min/max their coins in the sense of buying for as little as possible, and selling for as much as possible. This is the normal behavior, and not creating sustainable relationships or supporting an ongoing multiplayer ecosystem, which is one of the things that people seem to argue against the most here.

Too much trouble, and not enough time. they want a warp to the cheapest seller and a warp to the highest buyer, please and thank you. This is the practically the literal definition behind the phrase, minimum effort / maximum reward.

Someone who comes in and sells themselves out of sustainability in a matter of weeks and then quits in 6 weeks from burnout and being tired of working so hard and still not making any margin (here’s one thing I call stabbing yourself in the foot) may put several other long term players off the game because suddenly they have zero business for more than a month. Or have to compete on margins so thin they can’t afford to support their own desire to build or play other parts of the game, it’s just not worth it to them any more.

I’ve seen this happen a few times, especially with forgers. And cooks.

And that’s why you see so much worry and talk about these things when a system like this comes up. Even from people that are, in the end, eager for the system. It’s not that the system causes these behaviors, but it facilitates them. And plenty of us would prefer that it not be built in such a way as to maximize them.

I’ve said a little about the potential pros of this system, and a lot about potential cons. Others too, i think mostly because the pros of the system are obvious and most of us want something like this in place. I don’t think that anyone here is expressly trying to argue against an index, though some would prefer more, or something different in its place.

Still, in the realm of specific targeted feedback on the design as presented:

I’m not worried about placement in the list. In fact I’m doing fine without any list. But I am concerned about not even being in the list because once there is a list, very few players will look past it. And I think there are plenty of other people here who think they can attract buyers on volume, location, or other angles but only if they are actually on the list.

These people will not be fighting with a goal of undercutting, or for top placement on the list. But if they feel they have to, they will go as far as they can to actually get on the list. With only 16 slots on a busy planet and (presumably) centicoin increments for bumping yourself up on the list, this can turn into obsessive list watching etc … and again, turn people even further off the notion of playing the game.

Paging a query is not much more resource intensive, and the increase is on-demand, not static. I suspect the reason that some of the features already in the back end but not being exposed currently have as much to do with interface design as with concerns about load. Considering the “roots” of the game I hope so, at least.

But in terms of actual feedback as much as any worry or what some people call complaining, I would VERY MUCH like to see this list be browsable to it’s full depth.

Honestly I think knowing that everyone will be visible anyways would help to devalue or even suppress a lot of the behaviors that people are concerned about.

I honestly think this would be “worth it’s weight” in implementation cost.

Editing to add: I haven’t actually seen screens of this, though it’s been mentioned. Is anyone that’s been on test looking at the display or rounding of partial coin amounts, or prices in excess of 4 digits?